# Sometimes they surprise you



## texasred (Jan 29, 2012)

I always work the dogs into the wind if were hunting or doing bird work. On days were just out for exercise I don't pay much attention to which way its blowing. My little one really surprised me. She would run out about 50 - 75 yards and then make a zigzag pattern working her way back to me. She kept repeating this in diffrent areas. She has never done this before. She always works going away from me and depending on the cover she can be 75-150 yards out. It finally dawned on me she was working the wind. Once we changed direction she went right back to her normal way of hunting.


----------



## Linescreamer (Sep 28, 2010)

Haaah. The old adage, "Most Vizslas are smarter then their owners".  You got a good one there!


----------



## datacan (May 15, 2011)

off topic maybe,

I read once that dogs don't learn by example, instead they learn by trial and error process.

The experiment went like this: They caged hungry dogs. They could only get out only if they opened a door that had a simple latch on it. Push the leaver up and door opens. Even after they were shown, it took them trial and error to figure it out.
They did same with cats, the cats opened the door faster :-\ 

Now, I had Sam look for 10 minutes at a well trained retriever work away and the next day my Sam did much better at retrieving. 
Maybe the researchers should have tried the experiment with a Vizsla.


----------



## polkan (Dec 29, 2011)

datacan: not sure if this is what you're referring to, but according to the inventor of operant conditioning, the cats in puzzle boxes didn't learn faster with observation than with trial and error. Not sure if they were faster learners than dogs...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edward_Thorndike#Connectionism

I think TexasRed's story is about a gifted Vizsla that hasn't lost what it was bred for....the one that "hunts for you"...


----------



## datacan (May 15, 2011)

@ polkan 
It is off topic, as I mentioned... I'm currently reading from Behaviorism and cognitive ethology. 
It was Thorndike, he noted a difference between dogs and cats..."dogs were much inferior in escaping." And all learning was done by trial and error and not by watching.

This kind of made me wonder... because I think he must have done the experiment with Afghan hounds, *I saw my dog learn from another dog just by watching. * 
In my mind this is what linked it to the topic "Sometimes they surprise you".


----------



## polkan (Dec 29, 2011)

Oh wow, I'm going to read up on that...! My focus is Steven Lindsay at the moment, but it's a very interesting topic, thanks for mentioning it...


----------



## datacan (May 15, 2011)

"Dog Behavior, Evolution, and Cognition" by Adam Miklosi in pdf (love my Ipad)


----------



## R E McCraith (Nov 24, 2011)

Sorry-always thought cats were live bumpers you throw for your V(LOL-do not report me to PETA)


----------



## texasred (Jan 29, 2012)

datacan said:


> off topic maybe,
> 
> I read once that dogs don't learn by example, instead they learn by trial and error process.
> 
> ...


I believe a smart dog can learn by example and trial and error.
If they don't learn by example then why does a young pup excel when worked with a more experienced one.
Second I taught one of my vocal dogs to speak on command. The funny part of it was I used my daughter to teach this trick. I would tell her speak. Then she would woof and I would act like I was giving her the treat. With in ten minutes the pup would speak on command.
As for trial and error. These pups do this everyday. Watch a pup just run and try to catch a bird. A few weeks later that same pup will be stalking instead of chasing.


polkan said:


> I think TexasRed's story is about a gifted Vizsla that hasn't lost what it was bred for....the one that "hunts for you"...


Yes it was but I can see where the other posts would go with my post. I have no idea if she learned it by example, meaning hunting we always work into the wind. She may have learn it by trial and error. Hunting into the wind I find birds, hunting with the wind at my back I don't. I just wish I had put birds in the field for her that day.


----------

