# Bad Puppy, or Bad Owner



## janz99 (Aug 23, 2010)

Hey guys, ive been lurking on this forum since we decieded to get a V but havnt had to post up untill now.

We just picked up ower new addition to the family on saturday, so she has only been in the house with us for 2 days. She is just over 8 weeks old. We are trying to crate train her but we are having some issues with her potty"ing in the house. I will take her outside as soon as she comes out of the crate, or when she is done eating, sometimes she goes on the lawn but other times she will just run around to play. 

Ive tried picking her back up and placing her in the spot i want her to potty in, but she just thinks its a game and the cycle continues for 10-15 min untill i give up and let her run around. Then most times she wont go pee for me outside. 

Ill bring her back in and and she'll play for less then 2 min, and then pee on the floor even though we were just outside. It doesnt matter how long i leave her outside for sometimes she just wont go. getting her to run alot outside seems to help her pee but how long will i have to keep running around the yard with her just to get her to go pee so she can come inside. 

We praise her and pet her when she goes outside as much we possibly can so she knows that it pleases us but i dont think she gets it lol.

Another issue we seen to be having, is with her getting into things she isnt suppose to or jumping up on us, and furniture she shouldnt. I feel like we are constantly saying "NO BELLA" I want her to bond with is, and i feel like we are always giving her negatives i just dont want to be doing more harm then good with her being at such a young age. Last night i feel like i was really hard on her when she peed on the carpet twice in a row in less then 5 min and i felt so bad afterwards.

I brought her in and it was late enough for her to go to bed, so she ended up going into the crate alnost right after. I know now i should never be that hard on her, but id like to hear what has worked for you guys? Am i doing this completly wrong? 

Any advice would be greatly appreaciated.


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## Mercutio (Jan 18, 2010)

Congratulations on the new puppy! They are SO cute....... and SO naughty ;D

Our boy for some reason was super-easy to house-train. Actually I don't think we did any training, he just kind of worked it out.

Our vet told us though that until they are 14 weeks old puppies don't have any bladder control so until then all you can do is manage the situation and get them outside as quick as you can to get them used to going outside. But at 8 weeks they aren't really in charge of their own bodies. This doesn't help you any but it might make it a little less frustrating.

I spent many icy evenings standing outside waiting for Merc to go to the toilet before bedtime whilst he sniffed around, chased moths, stared at possums.... and didn't seem to notice the temperature - you're not alone with hanging around waiting for the dog to decide it's going to do what it needs to do! I think I did this for about a year and now at bed-time he goes outside with some kibble and when he is done eating, toileting and chasing whatever it is that lives in our yard he comes and sits at the door waiting to be let back in. 

Merc is my first V so I have no idea how typical he is but he turned my life totally upside down for about 18 months and now he is nearly 3 and somethings are easier to deal with (but life is still totally different to how it was 3.5 years ago!)

Good luck


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## gunnr (Aug 14, 2009)

Janz99

Congrat's on your new puppy. She sounds like she's going to be a very bold little girl. It's not a case of either a bad owner, or a bad puppy 
At 8 weeks old puppies don't do anything bad on purpose. They just "do". Don't be "hard on her" she won't understand at this point.

Your new puppy does 4 things. Play, Eat, Sleep, and Go to the bathroom. If she is not actively engaged in the 1st three activities, she's getting ready to do the fourth.
Unfortunately at this point she can't yet be commanded to "do her stuff", but she very soon can be.
You are literally going to have have to watch her constantly for a little while. The moment she "pauses" in the house from playing, out she goes. I mean immediately. Pick her up gently and take her outside and tell her to do her stuff in a nice happy sing song voice, and when she does make a really big fuss over her with lots of praise and pets.
When she comes out of her crate. it's out the door immediately in the same manner.
A few minutes after eating she may engage in some playtime. Watch her at this time. If her nose goes to the floor, or she just kind of "stops doing anything" for a few moments, out the door.
When you pick her up to take her out the door, cup her rear end in your hand and support her by her chest. If you pick her by her tummy, you'll put additional pressure on her stomach and bladder and may end up with her weeing all the way to the door.

She is going to get into anything and everything within her reach. If it's really valuable, or of sentimental value, and it's within her reach, put it away for a few months. 
There is going to be a lot of "No,No Bella" for awhile. Don't yell or scream, and try to not to rush at her, but in an even tone of voice, with firmness, command "NO-NO" and gently take the object away, and then give her one of her toys.

Over the next few weeks/months you need to be very consistent with her so that she is able to get a clear "picture" of what you expect. Try not to yell or raise your voice too much, just be very firm and fair, keeping your voice in a neutral tone so that she doesn't get confusing messages. End each "lesson", or "correction" on a positive. Make sure she gets to "do something right".


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## janz99 (Aug 23, 2010)

Thanks guys! This is our first V as well, and very different from any other dog that we have ever had. Im glad to hear her behaviour is normal and that everything is as it should be for an 8 week old pup! 

Im going to make sure that i am not so hard on her, and make sure we are very consistant on how we train her. Its nice to hear other ppl have been in the same situation! She is definitly one adorable little girl! 

Ill try and post some pics later!


Thanks again!
Ryan


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## maple (Jul 22, 2010)

Congrats on the new puppy! We just got ours recently, she's a lot of work! Gunnr had great advice! Maple was very well potty trained when we got her, but sometimes we miss those cues of her needing to go, and she pees inside the house. It's our fault, because at that age they can't control their bladders well...you just need to constantly watch them. When they have a big drink of water, they'll need to pee. When they eat their food, they'll need to go. When they're playing and start suddenly sniffing around, they need to go. And when they whine for no reason, they most likely have to go. Pretty much every 30 minutes it seems(unless they're sleeping) they need to go!

What we did with Maple from the beginning (and with my old dog from the moment we got her) was tell her to "get busy" as soon we we brought her outside. When she would try to play right away, we would put her back on the grass and tell her to "get busy" until she went. As soon as she would do her business, we would say "get busy" and "good girl" in a higher praising voice. She has seemed to catch on already, because as soon as we say it now she'll go to the grass and pee. Whenever she goes inside, we will pick her up (even if it means she's still peeing -- which usually ends up on one of us) and bring her outside and tell her to get busy. By doing this she knows that it's not play time just yet, and she needs to take care of her business first.

The whole jumping on the couch part, we've been dealing with that for a week straight, 100 times a day. They don't retain too much at this age, and you just need to be consistent (as Gunnr said) with them. Nothing forceful, but enough that soon they'll learn that they are not allowed up on the couch. As soon as you let them up (which we made the mistake of doing), they'll always come back for more!

Goodluck with everything! They're definitely a lot different than anything you've probably ever had. You're exhausted at the end of the day, and sometimes just want to give up. But there are so so so many moments that make all of this worth it


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## janz99 (Aug 23, 2010)

What do you guys think about taking her into the pool at this age? We were at my parents house, and we were in the pool. She was very curious as to what it was and trying to climb up the ladder, so i had my GF pass her up and she sat curiously on the ladder watching me swim. Finally i held her, and slowly lowered her into the water to see if she minded getting her feet wet.

She didnt mind that, so we went alittle deeper, to the point where she was basicly swimming with me just holding her belly. Eventually she was swimming on her own. She wasnt wimpering or squirming away, so i felt that she was ok in the water with me for small periods of time. She did get alittle cold and started to shiver a bit, so we took her out immediatly and wrapped her up in the blanket, which she then began to chew like mad and play with lol. I just want to make sure we arnt pushing her to far to fast.


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## maple (Jul 22, 2010)

haha, this sounds too familiar to me. I just posted this a few hours ago about my puppy swimming this weekend. We did the exact same thing, and she was fine swimming on her own. She loved it! I would say not to push it though...every now and then is alright i'm sure. You wouldn't want anything bad to happen that will deter her from swimming later on, and the chlorine is probably not the greatest for their skin (dries their skin out too much). Maple was pretty cold afterward too and took a while to warm up...and just for that reason alone I wouldn't push the swimming thing too much until they get a little bit bigger. But if it's warm out I may have her try again at the cottage lake.

Funny thing seeing them swim at such a young age though!


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## gunnr (Aug 14, 2009)

Ryan

You've introduced her to water pretty much exactly the way all the books outline.
You let her define her level of comfort, provided support and encouragement, and at the end she got lots of attention in the form of a toweling off. Let her work her water entries at her own pace and you'll have no issues.


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## janz99 (Aug 23, 2010)

Thats good to hear. How often do you think it is ok to let her in the water at first? Should we be making regular trips over, or just let her leave on that note untill she is older? 

Thanks
Ryan


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## DarDog (Aug 15, 2010)

Hi Janz99,

Another recommendation to help with the potty training, is to start using a command (we say "hurry up") when she is going to the bathroom. She will soon associate the word, and peeing. This has been a great help to us, especially when you need to get your dog to go to the bathroom quickly!

I would also recommend not saying her name when saying NO. You want them to associate their name with positives, not so much corrections.

Enjoy your pup!


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## gunnr (Aug 14, 2009)

janz99 said:


> Thats good to hear. How often do you think it is ok to let her in the water at first? Should we be making regular trips over, or just let her leave on that note untill she is older?
> 
> Thanks
> Ryan


As often as you can. 
Just make sure it stays fun, maybe introduce a floating toy to encourage her to fetch. Have no expectations though, except for play.
Take it slow.


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## janz99 (Aug 23, 2010)

I must be doing something wrong..... i came home today, she had been in the crate for about 6 hours while we were at work. We went right outside, she pee'd then about 10 min later went poop. So after about 20 min of playing, i decied to bring her inside. I feed her, then we go back outside. 

Takes a bit of running and playing to get her to go, but she goes. We come back in to make dinner, and she pees on the floor. I caught her in the act, scolded her "NO" and take her outside in mid pee. She really hates when i do this, because as soon as i put her in the grass she wants nothing to do with me and tries to run past me up on the deck and back inside the house. I always try to pick her up and place her back on the spot in the yard. 

To make a long story short, she peed 4 times in a row in the house. After each time, i made sure she went be before i brought her back in the house. What am i doing wrong here.... She is so good about going after she has been in the crate for extended periods and has never went in the kennel. 

Is she maybe squating to pee outside but nothing is comeing out? Could she have something wrong? Or am i just over reacting.....


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## Mischa (Feb 17, 2010)

janz99 said:


> I must be doing something wrong..... i came home today, she had been in the crate for about 6 hours while we were at work. We went right outside, she pee'd then about 10 min later went poop. So after about 20 min of playing, i decied to bring her inside. I feed her, then we go back outside.
> 
> Takes a bit of running and playing to get her to go, but she goes. We come back in to make dinner, and she pees on the floor. I caught her in the act, scolded her "NO" and take her outside in mid pee. She really hates when i do this, because as soon as i put her in the grass she wants nothing to do with me and tries to run past me up on the deck and back inside the house. I always try to pick her up and place her back on the spot in the yard.
> 
> ...


Our pup had a urinary tract infection that lasted ~ a month on and off. She was on an anti-biotic, but outgrew the strength and the UTI came back, so we had to up the dosage.
It might be worthwhile to take a pee sample(we used a small tupperware container) into the vet and have them run a test, but if she's holding it for 6 hours, this may not be the case.

The moral of the story is, you're doing everything you're suppose to. Keep at it and you'll get that great relief of a house-trained dog, soon.

We would watch her constantly looking for the slightest que that she was about to pee. We'd take her out, she'd go, we'd praise, bring her back in, and she's peeing on the floor 5 minutes later. Yes, very aggravating after a few weeks.
BUT, once our Mischa got over her UTI, she was magically housetrained!  And we could finally stop washing out her crate, and spot cleaning the carpets, and mopping up the hardwood... (you're not alone)

Also, just so you can feel a bit better as it sounds like yours sleeps through the night, Mischa would wake us up 2-3 times each night for a few weeks to either be let out, or to have us clean up a puddle in her crate. With a UTI they have no bladder control at all, it just falls out of them. 

My g/f had lunch time walking/feeding duty since she worked close by, so that meant I was on the night shift with Mischa...thank god that's over!!!! ;D


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## janz99 (Aug 23, 2010)

Thanks again guys! We really do appreciated all the advise everyone is giving us. Cleaning up pee every 10 min is getting very frustrating, and at times we are harder on her then we really should be. We are working on that, and making sure we arnt to hard on her, because she is just a pup. 

She does sleep through the night, it might have something to do with how much we are walking/playing with her. She is on the go from the time we get home from work untill around 830 pm. She literally comes in and crashes on her little bed, which is very relieving, since by that time im ready for bed to lol. 

We are just hoping she gets better with the potty training as the weeks go [email protected]


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## Tulip (Feb 14, 2010)

Hi, we used puppy pads. I know there will be mixed views on here about them but it worked for us and saved a lot of clearing up, not cheap tho! It was winter when our pup arrived, and he was traumatised by the rain making the potty training extra tricky! Was mostly clean by 12 weeks and totally clean by 20 weeks. Enjoy your lovely little bundle, have fun


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## janz99 (Aug 23, 2010)

So to our suprise, she has been peeing in her crate over night. I didnt notice it the last couple of days, but today i cleaned out her crate and noticed her bottom blanket was wet in the back corner. 

So my question is, how ofter should i be letting her out during the night? She normaly gets up crying twice a night around 2 and around 4am. Is she trying to tell us she has to pee, or just whinning because she is still in the kennal.


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## Crazy Kian (Aug 10, 2009)

Probably both.
We would take Kian out as he started to whine (at that age) and then back in his crate when he was done. 
Don't let him trick you into playtime at 2:00 am.


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## janz99 (Aug 23, 2010)

If she needs out twice in the middle of the night, does that sound reasonable, or should i just set my alarm clock and let her out once in the middle of the night to do her buisness?


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## kelevra (Apr 15, 2010)

Personally i wouldn't let her out at all. I would take her water away around 8pm then make sure she empties before she goes to sleep but make sure she is very tired. Set an alarm for nice and early 6/7am then go down and let her out.

One thing we found was that Storm didn't like anything in his crate that didn't smell of him. For instance if we put a T-shirt in there that smelt of one of us for comfort he would instantly wee on it. All he has in his crate now is his Ruff Tuff bed and a couple of toys, we also blocked off half the cage so he doesn't have as much room as he did before.


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## Vespasia (Apr 19, 2010)

A rule of thumb that I was given that seemed reasonable and was very helpful is that you shouldn't expect your puppy to hold his bladder longer than his age in months + plus one (3 month puppy can hold bladder for 4 hours)


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## Brodie (Feb 13, 2010)

We used to take Brodie out twice at night when he was that age and learned that after 7 pm the water dish went up for the night. We'd take him out a few more times before bed then put him in his crate for night. If he did whine (usually around 1 am and 4 am) we'd take him out and made sure it was short and to the point. Out of crate, outside, business, then back inside to his crate. No playing or anything because we wanted him to know that bedtime was bedtime ... not playtime! 

By 3 months, we were only making one trip down at night and discovered that the 2nd time he would whine (about 5:30) we could get away with letting him cuddle in bed until our alarm went off  At 13 months, he still whines at 5:30 to come snuggle for a bit 

Don't get discouraged! It takes takes time, and can be frustrating, but eventually you will be able to recognize the signs that she needs to go during the day and will figure out a system that works for both of you at night!


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## janz99 (Aug 23, 2010)

Exactly the same times that Bella has to go out. Around 1 and 4am. I havnt tried taking the water dish away, just because i didnt want her to ever think that it wont be available if she wants it. Ill try putting it up around 7 as well and see if this helps. 

I also made a spacer inside the crate to try and limit her space. She was peeing in the back, and then sleeping right up front against the cage portion. So far it seems to be keeping her from peeing in the crate. 

When she cries in the crate, it is extremely loud, its not just a soft wimper. Is this normaly?


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## Brodie (Feb 13, 2010)

No different then teaching an infant that their crib is a "safe place"  Brodie did the same thing (whining), used to make me think the neighbors would start complaining. After a while he settled down ... if all else you could try putting a blanket to make it darker in her create ... though, somehow our boy managed to have most of it INSIDE the crate lol A spray of water worked too


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## janz99 (Aug 23, 2010)

Hey guys! Just thought i would post up alittle progress. She is now 9 weeks old (we've had her for 1 week) and we are officially on day 4 of no accidents in the house. She is doing better and better every day when she goes in her crate. She cries for less then 10 min now each time she goes in, sometimes not at all if she is tired. 

She is still biting like crazy, but for the most part she is keeping to her own toys/bed. 
We are now working on the jumping up, and walking on a leash. She walks fairly well without a leash, and will follow me everywhere i go. Once you strap the leash to her, i do more dragging her then she does walking. Its getting better though! ONE day at a time  

Thanks again for all the help and advise! We do really apreciate it!


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## kelevra (Apr 15, 2010)

One thing we did with the crate that helped loads was waiting til he fell asleep on our lap/on the floor then gently take him to his crate and leave him there with the door open.


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