# Retrieve/Whoa Drill with Rufus Tiberius



## WillowyndRanch (Apr 3, 2012)

Some of you may know RT, aka Rufus Tiberies, aka Rufus Tiberius Maxiumus III, aka "circus dog". Yesterday I took some video of us working on a whoa/retrieve drill that he's rather enthusiastic about. He's not perfect, still has small movements on whoa, but I especially was proud of him for hitting the brakes on his "send", especially difficult for him with his retrieve drive. 

It may not look like much, but this is actually the result of many, many, many weeks of training.






Ken


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## harrigab (Aug 21, 2011)

working on the birds with my two, I know how hard this discipline is to instil Ken, good work . Mine will "Whoa" with the dummy, but the buggers won't whoa to a rifle shot if we're out hunting rabbits. They will sit tight to a shotgun on birds though, although I do have to give them a reminder every now and then about that too!. I do think that the "Whoa" or "Stop" command is the most essential command to teach a dog.


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## Bob Engelhardt (Feb 14, 2012)

WillowyndRanch said:


> ...
> It may not look like much, ...


No, it does look like a lot. I have great admiration for the patience that you must have for training.

I was expecting a "good boy" when he did the whoa's. What is your philosophy about giving praise?


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## texasred (Jan 29, 2012)

I don't have half the experience that Ken does, but this is my take on why praise is not done at that time.

1 The task is not complete. Whoa is just one small (large) step in the task being asked. The task is only finished, when the retrieve is brought to you. 
2 Ty is very intently waiting for the release command. Praise at that time is not going to get you the results your looking for. And in a dogs mind, the release is a higher value than any praise is going to be. 

It's a lot of small steps to teach, and then brought together to complete one task.


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## Bob Engelhardt (Feb 14, 2012)

TR - that makes perfect sense, thanks.


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## MikoMN (Nov 29, 2016)

Looks good to me. I haven't started the whoa command yet. I'm not even sure where to start. I can tell him to sit and stay while I throw the bumper, and then release him, but if he were in full stride, I very much doubt he would stop.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## texasred (Jan 29, 2012)

MikoMN 
Hoping Ken will go through some steps. 
A lot of work is put in, before you ask a dog to whoa in the middle of a retrieve.
You not only have all the retriever work, you also have all the whoa training. 

Not sure what order Ken puts it in. 
I've always worked on whoa first. 
Then worked on fetch. Only brought the two together, after the dog was separately solid on both. 

What like most about the video, is how happy Ty is while working.


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## WillowyndRanch (Apr 3, 2012)

I'll try to find some time to work on that request. But in short, we do initially separate the two (generally - though not always) into different lessons then bring them together - however we do retrieve play with dogs at the end of any session of training, from whoa work to bird intro to heeling. We find that ending the session with play retrieving de-stresses the dog and has the added bonus of making the retrieve a great reward for most dogs. 

Ken


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## RufusTiberius (Jun 15, 2017)

As Rufus Tiberius's owner I truly enjoyed watching RT in this video. From all my conversations with Ken, teaching and getting RT to whoa on command has been the hardest thing for him (Ken) to get RT to do. His prey drive is so strong he just wants to go get the bird. Finally a littler bit of progress on the whoa. Thank you Ken.

Charles,
Rufus Tiberius's Absentee Owner


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## WillowyndRanch (Apr 3, 2012)

Bob Engelhardt said:


> No, it does look like a lot. I have great admiration for the patience that you must have for training.
> 
> I was expecting a "good boy" when he did the whoa's. What is your philosophy about giving praise?


Hi Bob,
Good question - as with many things it depends a lot on the dog, the task and where their weakness lies. 

In this instance, the dog (TY) is a bursting bundle of energy just waiting to explode at virtually everything. He's a high octane dog in every way which is also a great lot of fun! Had I given a "good boy" for whoaing he would take that as a cue that we were done with the exercise and bounded after the dummy. I use a physical and verbal release - a tap on his flank that you can't see along with his name. You may have noticed that even when sending him I practically whispered the release. I do this with him as he doesn't need me to project any further excitement into the task at hand - that would be counter-productive. Other dogs would have a very excited release to help encourage them. Dog's with a lesser retrieve drive I praise immediately upon pickup and all the way back to me during training.

Ken


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## organicthoughts (Oct 9, 2012)

Ken,

Ty's enthusiasm reminds me a lot of my dog. When you are woahing him do you tap the e-collar each time or only when he moves after the woah command?


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## WillowyndRanch (Apr 3, 2012)

The e-collar was a late phase of training with him. We spent a great deal of time with him on check cord and in his instance a pinch collar due to his power and drive I simply couldn't hold him in a flat collar. And that was without distraction of a bird or dummy, just stopping to pressure and cue. We added distractions of bumpers and birds using the same. Then when he knew the cue and command we overlaid the e-collar cue to stop and stand in the same order. Only when he moves on tossing the dummy or flight of bird do we reinforce with the e-collar cue to stop. It's very important to not use the e-collar on a dog that is creeping, it can manifest in many negative ways. Upon flight (bird or dummy), or without birds in the picture at all. Hope that makes sense. 
Best,
Ken


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## organicthoughts (Oct 9, 2012)

Makes sense. What do you do to thwart the creeping or from busting when birds are in the picture when the dog knows woah and to woah around birds?

I'm at that point with my dog where he is essentially broke on wild birds but in trials/tests/training with pigeons or pen raised birds he will break point.


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## WillowyndRanch (Apr 3, 2012)

We would likely use launchers. As soon as the dog moves, the bird flushes. When the bird flushes you can get your correction. It gets tough when dogs are "trial wise" and then we look for fun day events or mock tests to help simulate all the excitement and hubub of an event where we can use training aids and training is not only allowed but encouraged.

The other thought is you back all the way up to standing with the dog, a check cord loop and work on proofing with walking birds. A tied wing or a tethered bird. The really important thing here is to get in a light correction *with restraint* and look for the point where you see the dog _wants_ to break, but then he demonstrates self-restraint - catches himself. At that moment, before they have the opportunity to go again, give a reward/praise and stop. The biggest problem when doing this type of training is to not mark the behavior we seek. We humans tend to push again and again waiting for the break in order to correct. Try to work just below the threshold. Start with the bird some distance away, then gradually closer. Mix it up so it's not the same session over and over. Change grounds often. Also give a good run between birds and have some sessions where there are no birds - I find it helps a lot for the dogs to de-stress. 

Hope that helps.
Ken


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## organicthoughts (Oct 9, 2012)

Thanks Ken. This is very hepful


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