# Local culture and the spay/neuter debate



## rubicon (Dec 9, 2019)

Hi all, my husband and I will be moving overseas soon and one of the questions that plagues me somewhat is neutering our dog.

Frankly, we don’t plan on it and even if we do it to limit breeding, we hope to get a vasectomy instead of full on neutering. Our dog’s behaviour is perfect and I’ve never seen him mount another dog. And we don’t have females in heat at the park; the owners know to keep them home. We live in West Germany and most of my neighbours have intact dogs of all breeds and they play just fine and I don’t get the sense there’s unwanted breeding, crazy aggression or anything And the culture here is, don’t alter unless you have to. Legit, I have NEVER seen a dog fight or even egregious bullying in more than a year of having him.

But my husband is American (so not ruling out one day we might move there) and we’re almost certainly moving to the UK in the near future. My impression is that spaying/neutering is a hot debate there and almost all responsibly owned dogs are altered, which may lead to neutered males being aggressive towards intact males. And I’ve read enough dog related reddit to know that not neutering is seen VERY negatively in America.

I know a lot of people here are not neutering, or at least waiting until 2 years to neuter. Do you guys encounter any difficulties with other owners at all? Is your dog really going to be a pariah at dog parks, or is this just overblown internet moral panic?

Thanks for your insights!


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## texasred (Jan 29, 2012)

My dogs are normally out with other dogs that hunt, and most of them are not spayed, or neutered. I don't do dog parks, so I can't help you with that.
If you move to the US, look up your local Viz Whizz. The have a lot of weekend get togethers, in outdoor places.


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## Gabica (Jan 20, 2018)

We do several dog sports with my 2 intact males and have not encountered any negative attitude there. I fully understand your concerns, i went thru some soul searching myself in this area, not going to certain training places for example anymore because of negative attitude and certain assumptions (without any proven base) made there. Coming from Hungary i also grew up with the keep the dog intact and exercised and limit chemicals attitude. So yes, i would seek out for pure bred communities, hunting / and or conformation groups in the UK.
I also don`t do dog parks, just as texasred, living in Houston those are unfortunately not the safest places here.


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## Bob Engelhardt (Feb 14, 2012)

I think that it depends *a lot* on the location within the US. I'm in Massachusetts and there are many rescued dogs that have been brought in from out of area. E.g., Kentucky, IIRC, is the source of many. Around here spaying/neutering is almost universal and is only slowly changing. Kentucky being the source of so many rescues implies that there are many more intact dogs. If so, your intact dog is unlikely to get a second glance in Kentucky, but he definitely will here.

But a second glance doesn't mean castigation. Sure, there is a very small minority who get all self righteous in their misbeliefs. The noise that they make exaggerates the popularity of their beliefs. It's a squeaky-wheel thing: it's more likely that you'll hear the stories of negative reactions to intact dogs than you'll hear the stories of indifference.

My neutered male does react to intact males, but not aggressively. The owners of intact males that I've met have not mentioned aggressive encounters.


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## Dan_A (Jan 19, 2021)

I find this topic very interesting. I live in the US and am leaning towards not spaying our female pup. My main reasons are focused around the biological functions of reproductive hormones on overall health, and why expose her to major surgery if nothing is wrong with her. If i did, I would wait a minimum of 1 or even 2 years to allow for full development to complete.

I think you will be just fine in the US perception-wise. Its not like you will be called out in public for your dog having fruit hanging from the tree. The vet will try to pressure you to get it done, but ultimately they want you as a paying customer and will back off if you tell them no. The main issues will be around kennel and boarding services, many require the dog to be spayed/neutered.


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## gunnr (Aug 14, 2009)

Unfortunately Vet's seem to be the pushiest about neutering/spaying. With Finn they were trying to schedule us to have it done in Finn's first year, but that wasn't going to happen. 
Finn will have to undergo a procedure as he has a non descended testicle, which opens him up to an increased cancer risk. What I want to do is have the surgery to go in and find the non-descended testicle, remove it, and perform a vasectomy on the descended testicle. This way he keeps his hormones intact.Whatever happens, won't happen until this time next year at the 2-1/2 year mark. The Vet wants to do it this spring, but nope.
I've had three males through the years and none were neutered. No problems with any of them. If not for Finn's non-descended testicle, he wouldn't be neutered either.
Stick to your guns. You are your dog's voice and advocate.


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## organicthoughts (Oct 9, 2012)

Don't worry so much about it

Keep your dogs intact and let the busy bodies deal with their own emotions


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## Adaba (Oct 14, 2015)

rubicon said:


> Hi all, my husband and I will be moving overseas soon and one of the questions that plagues me somewhat is neutering our dog.
> 
> Frankly, we don’t plan on it and even if we do it to limit breeding, we hope to get a vasectomy instead of full on neutering. Our dog’s behaviour is perfect and I’ve never seen him mount another dog. And we don’t have females in heat at the park; the owners know to keep them home. We live in West Germany and most of my neighbours have intact dogs of all breeds and they play just fine and I don’t get the sense there’s unwanted breeding, crazy aggression or anything And the culture here is, don’t alter unless you have to. Legit, I have NEVER seen a dog fight or even egregious bullying in more than a year of having him.
> 
> ...


We are in San Diego, California. Our male is intact as was out prior male. Yes there are some over opinionated instigators that feel strongly about neutering. I will say our vizslas have not had great experiences at dog parks and we do not go. Altered males have been more aggressive and there owners would occasional blame us for not fixing our dog, even though their dogs were the aggressors.
It is a personal choice and you should do what you think is right and not worry about the mostly uneducated opinions of others.


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## PhilipL (Sep 28, 2018)

I'm here in England and Big Rafa is intact at nearly three years old. I don't want to neuter him, his vet who is a female Vizsla owner herself said he is the best looking male Vizsla she has seen, don't know if that was a hint she wanted puppies or not.

I haven't had many bad encounters with other male dogs, they usually all want to play together and do zoomies. However there is one grumpy neutered male Vizsla that has always growled at Rafa every time he sees him, before he has even had the chance to see if he is intact or not! I think he is grumpy with every other male dog.

My wife and daughter worry that if we don't neuter Rafa he will be more prone to testicular cancer. I don't know if that is the case or not, but that if proven as a severe risk would be the only thing that would make me change my mind about keeping him intact.


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## redbirddog (Apr 23, 2010)

redbirddog - a hungarian pointer (vizsla) blog


REDBIRDDOG - a Hungarian Pointer blog that followed the adventures of two Hungarian Pointers or Red bird dogs (Vizslas) and their human companions through the West in search of birds and some very cool spots! 2009-2021. COMMENTS ALWAYS APPRECIATED AND ENJOYED. Thanks for visiting.




redbirddog.blogspot.com





A thread on all my posts on neutering done over 12 years. Hope this sheds some light on the subject for you..

RBD


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## Huggytree (Apr 21, 2020)

My 1 year old dog was peeing on men and other dogs at the dog park. It was either fix him or skip the dog park. He also got aggressive to other intact males. Not horribly aggressive but enough

He is much more passive now. At the dog park he used to mark 40-50x. Now it’s 10x or less.


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## PhilipL (Sep 28, 2018)

RBD, thank you for your research and fact finding over 12 years, it was very informative and helpful. Lots of things I had never heard of before and all the pros and cons to weigh up and consider.


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