# poor H



## Hbomb (Jan 24, 2012)

Poor H has had a bit of a scare. We were out walking and came across a dog that I know doesn't like him. It's a collie type and the owner nomally puts it on a lead when he sees another dog. Every time H has walked passed it (both on lead) it has growled and lunged at him.

Anyway yesterday it appeared off its lead. I asked husband to call H to us and he came. The dog then, without warning, went for H and tried to jump on top of him snarling and snapping. H howled and my husband let go of him so he could run off. He didn't though, he just rolled over on his back and the dog again jumped top of him and poor H was howling. 

The owner (an old man) was really panicked and tried to call his dog to him but it was ignoring him. Eventually my husband managed to pull the dog off H and gave it back to the owner. The owner was very apologetic saying he did not see us coming or he would have leashed his dog. H has not been hurt really, he just has a superficial bite mark to his back leg which is not penetrating.

H is his normal bouncy self today. It just gave us a bit of a fright as this is the first time we have encountered a dog that has shown such unprovoked aggression. It also concerns me that H didn' t even try to run away just rolled over. I guess that this dog was more bark than bite as H was not bady hurt at all- it just appeared very vicious and did not back down- the owner did not seem to be able to control it either.

I was just wondering what the best way would be to handle a similar aggressive dog and if anybody else had experience?


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## mswhipple (Mar 7, 2011)

Poor H! I'm glad he wasn't hurt too badly! And I'm sure my Willie boy would react in exactly the same way. H probably got some pretty hurt feelings out of the whole episode. Wish I could offer you some decent advice, but I can't. There really is no predicting how well other dog owners have trained their dogs.


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## texasred (Jan 29, 2012)

H did what most dogs will do if they consider themselves lower on the totem pole. Show that they are being submissive, and that they are in no way challenging the other dog.
Not very nice, but if you walk the same trails as this dog you might want to carry a big stick or cane.
I step in between the other dog and mine. Make your body posture big and your voice mean. Tell the other dog to GET, and if you need to use the cane before it reaches your dog. And yes you can get bit doing this.
You also need to look up how to break up a dog fight.
Basically you use the aggressors hind legs as you would a wheel barrel. Lift them both at the same time, pull backwards while turning a circle to keep the dog from turning on you. DO NOT turn the dog loose before the owner has leashed it. If you do, it will go back after H or you.


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## texasred (Jan 29, 2012)

I found one of the good videos for you.
It explains it better than I can.
Just want to let you know again, that you can get bit doing this.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f7xrLXQNG0I


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## Bob Engelhardt (Feb 14, 2012)

The other dog didn't want to hurt H - if it had wanted to, H would have been much more seriously injured. A serious bite can be inflicted in an instant. And 2 or 3 more before it can be stopped.

The dog was asserting his dominance and H complied. I suspect that if the conflict had continued it would have calmed down, with the collie staying over H until he was satisfied with H's submission and then backed off. But that's a guess and I wouldn't count on it. I'd take a stick like Red suggested, to show YOUR dominance.

My sympathies - you're probably more upset about this than H is.

Bob


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## MilesMom (Jun 21, 2012)

I'm sorry that happened to you guys! How scary.


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## Vizsla Baby (Nov 4, 2011)

Personally, I would keep mace on hand. And a stick or a golf club. The old man needs to be walking his dog on a leash! Aren't there leash laws where you live?


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## redbirddog (Apr 23, 2010)

> The old man needs to be walking his dog on a leash! Aren't there leash laws where you live?


No more leash laws then needed please. Some dogs are butts. Luckily that is just maybe 1%. We don't want to punish the 99% of good dogs making them live an unnecessary life at the end of a 6 foot leash.

We, here in the SF Bay Area, fight a constant battle to keep the off-leash areas open. We are lucky to have some wonderful areas. 

The collie could have hurt H but didn't. Dogs are dogs sometimes. Glad your pup is ok.

RBD


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## hobbsy1010 (Jun 4, 2011)

The collie could have hurt H but didn't. Dogs are dogs sometimes. Glad your pup is ok.

RBD
[/quote]

Really hate that saying with a 'Passion'......

"Dogs are dogs sometimes"!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Cost Me £55 vets bill when somebody last said that to me!!!

And my Pup had five stitches and a nice scar to Carry for the rest of his time from an Alaskan Malamute!!!!!!!


Hey, but dogs will be dogs............


Hobbsy


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## redbirddog (Apr 23, 2010)

> "Dogs are dogs sometimes"!!!!!!!!!!!!!


That is why I cross the street several times during a city walk to avoid many different situations. Also why I stay out of dog parks.

The more of your environment you can control, by being aware of what could happen, the better your chances with those "loose canons". When I'm hiking the hills I often think "Coyotes are coyotes" and they have done damage to some of my friend's Vizslas and taken after mine more than once.

Bailey has tangled with dogs over the last 4 years and even given some corrections to other dogs that I deemed appropriate, even though the owners of the other dogs might not see or understand the correction.

How dogs correct each other is not understood by most people. The collie was over the top and any of the mushing dogs are too close in temperament to wolves for my taste.

Sorry for the hate.

Happy and safe trails with off-leash good dogs.
RBD


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## R E McCraith (Nov 24, 2011)

Every Pup & Owner is different - forget this & you both are at risk !!!! lease laws do serve a purpose - protect us from owners that should never have a pup - all of mine have lived off lead under my control - this breaks the law in my county - I could careless - Awareness is the art of trying to keep your pup out of harms way - under your control - go to a field trial where everyone respects you & your pup & you do the same - DO NOT FIND THIS IN A DOG PARK !!!


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## hobbsy1010 (Jun 4, 2011)

I often watch my dogs 'Roll' over exuberant pups ( at speed....) on our walks, quite gentle but seems to always have the desired effect without any nastiness!!!

I love my dogs social behaviour when we go to a shoot.
Lots of dogs, lots of different breeds, lots of testosterone!!!

Yet the dogs etiquette/ behaviour seems to always be the same, well manored and very little scraping/ fighting.
They (pups) always seem to feel their owners enjoyment and realize that they are there to do a job, have some fun and behave.
Just my experience's of course!

I believe that the connection that an owner builds with this breed is unique. Maybe it's their 'closeness' to the owner but very shortly after owning one a switch seems to go on and you understand they are not an outwardly aggressive breed and any corrections they dish out seem to warranted or of a very low level, compared to other breeds.

Hobbsy


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## Hbomb (Jan 24, 2012)

Thankyou for all your replies! I'm pleased to say Herc is fine- we took him to another spot today and he got to play with a lot of friendly dogs 

@TR- thanks for the video link. If my dog was at risk of getting seriously hurt, I would just have to take the risk of getting bit. 

@bob- In retrospect I agree the dog was prob not trying to hurt H. H is quite fearful sometimes and tends to yelp if he's spooked by anything. 

@vizsla baby- we are in uk and there's no real leash laws here (but no dog parks either which sounds like a good thing. ). The man normally does leash his dog but let's it loose if there's no other dogs around. He told us it was aggressive with other dogs though, and had hurt a lab quite badly. This makes me wonder, wouldn't it be safer for all if he muzzled it?? 

@mswhipple-your willie sounds like a big softy like H- they must be both gentle giants . I can count the number of times I've heard H growl on one hand. Although he was sleep-growling last night- maybe he was dreaming of getting revenge on that nasty collie


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## Bob Engelhardt (Feb 14, 2012)

Hbomb said:


> Thankyou for all your replies! I'm pleased to say Herc is fine- we took him to another spot today and he got to play with a lot of friendly dogs


That's great -it shows no lasting effects.



Hbomb said:


> ...
> The man normally does leash his dog but let's it loose if there's no other dogs around. He told us it was aggressive with other dogs though, and had hurt a lab quite badly. This makes me wonder, wouldn't it be safer for all if he muzzled it??
> ...


" ... hurt a lab quite badly ..." - that puts it in another light entirely. Maybe the lab wasn't submitting, or maybe the collie is just plain dangerous. I agree that it should be muzzled. The owner is being irresponsible to let such a dog off leash at all.

Bob


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