# New 8 month old puppy. Rescue from a breeder. Having problems



## hipEchik (Apr 13, 2012)

_*I knew what to expect with the Vizsla breed in general but I had little info on Scout. He is 8 months old and I was told he is very sweet and not housebroken. The exact reverse has been true. He is housebroken, for me and he is sweet at times. My problem is aggression. Mind you he was given to the rescue by a breeder so mine is his third home in a week. That said, I am a bit scared of him. I've only had him a day. He's great on a leash. He's supposed to have been crate trained but I have to force him in there. Upon getting him in there he may go to sleep, or he may bark. I am exercising him a lot. I'm doing all the right things. Today he's started chewing. I am giving him his antler to chew on but I really think he is challenging me. I've not had a pup since I was a kid so am out of practice. Anyway, we are moving along and our challenges are many. My question is this. When I get afraid of him, IE: barking or growling at me should I put him a) outside b) in his crate c) in a bedroom. Last time I put him outside where he went nuts. I left him there but it got worse. So, when I let him in I had a bowl of food ready for him. It's really fundamentals right now so any help would be appreciated. I know he'll get there as he is very bright but right now I am exhausted. Thanks. Teri and Scout. *_[/color][/color]


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## texasred (Jan 29, 2012)

I would need more information on whats is happening when he starts barking and growling to even take a guess at it. The one thing I do know is never show fear. If he thinks he can back you down, then he will win any show down. Your new to him and your going to have to build a bond, with you being a Just and Fair boss.
If he is challenging you in a aggressive way it would be hard for me to believe this is the first time he has tried this with someone. I would tell the rescue that I want to know his Real history.


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## hipEchik (Apr 13, 2012)

Thank you TexasRed. Yes, he got here with a deep scratch over his eye and the rescue was less than forthcoming. Odd having come from a breeder. I will pay attention to his behavior before he gets aggressive. I am trying not to show fear but I have been fearful. Twice now I've isolated him. Once in his crate and once in the yard. I'm trying not to break the dog rules but my safety comes first. Then again as I said, sometimes he is very sweet. It could be he's overly tired, stressed. I just don't know either.


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## datacan (May 15, 2011)

First of all I assume the dog is healthy and all shots are up to date.

b) in his crate[/color] 
*I assume it is a large size wire crate!*

In any case, this dog is not tamed, even though it may have been house-trained as a puppy.

Let him bark and whine inside the crate. Optionally you can sit in front of the crate and just quietly look at him if you can take the barking (otherwise leave the room). 
He will calm down and lay down and behave docile. 
At that point you can slowly open the crate door and if he doesn't act up, feed him from your hand or place the food bowl inside or invite him to eat just outside the crate. Water can be placed inside the crate at all times. This is important if he eats dry kibble. 

I feed my dog 2 or 3 times/day and it is my personal preference to wet his kibble with warm water. I do not like the idea of leaving a food bowl full of dry kibble all day long. Feeding time, is a ritual controlled by me. This bonds the dog since food is of utmost value to animals.

Do this for as long it takes to tame him. Most dogs pass through this taming period. Do not allow him outside the crate unless he exercises or goes potty. 

Walk him on a short leash.

Good luck, it will pass and things will get better.


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## Aimless1 (Sep 25, 2011)

Glad you were there to rescue Scout. Sounds like your first day was difficult for both of you.

This was the first day. You haven't lived with dogs in awhile and you're trying to get comfortable with one in the house. Scout is in new surroundings with an uncertain past. No doubt he is fearful and is doing his best to protect himself. Important that you never show fear, even if you are fearful.

Behavior issues may disappear or diminish once you have established trust. Both you and Scout need to trust each other. Once that bond has been established training becomes easier and discipline meaningful. Be consistent, be gentle, be firm. Gentle him, pet him, play with him. Hold him close. Avoid startling him. Avoid movements that may appear threatening from his perspective. This is especially important if he has been abused. Don't forget to tell him how wonderful he is when Scout is behaving as you wish. Quiet? Tell him he is the most wonderful dog in the world. Goes into the kennel on his own? What a smart dog he is. You get the idea.

I would work on getting him to enter the crate on his own with several short training sessions. Make sure there is a reward that he likes. The reward may be a treat, but it can simply be your love. Try to make it fun. He may have been testing you, but he may have had an unpleasant experience in the crate in the past.

Good luck!


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## R E McCraith (Nov 24, 2011)

Hip - If the rescue center will give you the breeders name - you may be able to find out what type of temperment his dogs have - sad to say a breeder has a dog for 8mo and never took the time to house train him - read the posts and after a week if the aggression is still there I would go to a professional trainer for 1 on 1 lessons hang in there - there are no bad V's just bad owners and breeders!


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## texasred (Jan 29, 2012)

The breeder may have had him for 8 months, or he could have been sold and returned. Acted aggressive and relinquished to the rescue.

With barking in crates it depends on why he's barking.
Barking because he wants out I ignore the dog.
Barking aggressively I sit inches from the crate with my back turned to them till the barking stops. Ear plugs work great.

I personally like to keep a dog out with me if I'm have problems with one.
I keep them on a dominant dog collar with a leash and they have to sit or lay at my feet, and go everywhere in the house I go. I don't give them attention when they ask for it. They get attention when I decide. There is no getting on furniture. Sit ,Down and Place or reinforced.

This part is not for the faint of heart and I'm sure some people will be appalled. It does not hurt the dog other than his feeling. And Yes I have asked my vet. 
Even if they are barking the command has to be followed. I keep a normal tone to my voice. There is no yelling or waving arms. I do wear heavy jeans and boots just in case there is a bite. If its went that far I step on the leash and slide it till its tight. With the collar I have on it shuts off the dogs oxygen. The dog may fight it, but he will follow the Down command or passout. If he bites the only thing in his reach is my boot. I just wait for him to follow the command. Never had dog pass out and only had to use this on one vizsla. There is not much I won't try to save a dogs live.


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## luv2laugh (Oct 6, 2011)

No one has mentioned hand feeding yet. 

The first thing I would do is to give him food only by hand in the hopes of establishing 1) trust and 2) your dominance. So take away all free access to food. If he won't get close to you, this may be difficult. But that's what my gut says is a great place to start. 

I am feeling so sad for this poor puppy, but also realize the fear of having a dog growling/barking at you. I would be emailing every animal behaviorist/trainer that I could. This dog has been shifted around a bit, but I truly have no idea what to do. 

In the meantime write down what happened right before he barks/growls at you every time. We call them ABC charts.

A is for antacedent (what happens right before)
B is the behavior (describe the behavior)
C is the consequence (what happens after he barks).

This will provide great info for the trainer and you may be able to see a pattern yourself. Also, members here may be able to help you better if we can figure out why the little guy is growling/barking. 

I would ignore the barking/growling and consider a muzzle until I know the best way to act. A muzzle may give you the courage to act the way that you need to (depending on the root cause of the barking is) without fear of barking. Others may know more about muzzles.

All the best!! Welcome to the forums!!


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## SkyyMax (Apr 5, 2012)

Welcome to the forum! 
I believe it is too early to say that your new pup has aggression issues - he is under a lot of stress now, changing his home 3 times in 1 week. It will take time for him to adjust to a new place, new person in his life.
You only had the puppy for 1 day - have a lot of tasty treats and any time he is sweet, tail waging - reward. 
Make him work for his meal - "Sit" first, feed him in the crate, hopefully in a few days you will not have to force him to go in.
He needs to know - you control the resources (food, treats, toys).
Hand feeding is a good idea, you might also try adding a handful of food in his bowl, he eats, add more.
Try to stay calm, if you feel frustrated, take a break.
Growling should not be ignored, firmly say "No", put him in a crate and turn around, as soon as he stops (it could take a while) - "Good boy" and a treat.


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## hipEchik (Apr 13, 2012)

All good and helpful information, thank you so much! I cannot get any additional info about his past but there were 3 puppies on the vizsla rescue from the breeder so, I know it is not that Scout was returned for behavioral problems. Not trained x 8 months is pretty crazy IMO but it was a backyard breeder I am told. He's still doing the same things I described before. Great on the leash. Loving and learning a lot of the time but, very skittish and again tonight he came at me barking aggressively. Right before this I was walking around with a blanket on my shoulders. That's all I can really say. I put him in the crate (which always means throwing a treat in to get him in there) and I have ignored him since. He barked and whined x about 45 minutes but he's quiet now. I am in the same room with him but w my back to him and no idea if he's asleep. I've been sleeping w him downstairs but I just don't trust this pup yet. He's got to sleep in the crate. Again, I was told he was crate trained but he sure doesn't act like it. I have his toys in there to comfort him and my favorite blanket (now his) with my scent on it. I'm going to see how it goes for a while but will call in a trainer if I have to. For now I am assuming it's the change of scenery and my change of decisions on where he sleeps. This is his third night but the first time I have not caved to him and let him out of the crate. I understand now, I must show him that I am the boss. Thank you all. You're great folks and I really appreciate your time and effort! Scout is exhausting but I am hopeful he will grow to be a great dog! It's just that a 45 pound (puppy) barking aggressively is quite scary. I don't show my fear but he may smell it. Teri


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## hipEchik (Apr 13, 2012)

I just wanted to add that today it was a blanket that spooked him but he had just woken up. We were asleep on different couches. I really don't recall what happened prior to the incident the other day though. This may sound odd but he seems to wake up a bit grumpy. I am thinking he may have been penned with his brothers and sisters in the backyard kennel. Also, keep in mind that I am saying puppy but he is 45 lbs. It's really all guess work right now. My husband is on his way home and Scout always barks like mad when he comes in the door. I guess I am going to let him bark from his crate. Oh, and he is not asleep.. I checked. So, he's been in there for a bit over an hour and still not asleep. When I leave the room, he whines and barks. When I am here typing with my back to him, he is quiet. I am going to sleep on the couch in the same room with him. It's weird for me trying to get into a dog's head. I can read people really well so am going to go with that psychology until I figure this out! Thanks again all!


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## Shivangi (Jan 19, 2010)

IF he barks and whines when you leave the room while he's still in the crate, isn't that a sign of the fact that he desires your presence? After all, he doesn't seem to mind being in there with you around. I'm not sure if I am reading correctly into this, but I'd see that as a positive sign. 
Guys, please feel free to correct me interpretation if I'm misreading this situation.

If something spooks him out, let him sniff it by leaving it on the ground and coaxing him to come close to it by offering a treat. Our V is 3 years and afraid of umbrellas! We used to have this huge black umbrella that was left at the side of the front door and it kept toppling over her every time she ran towards the door. An umbrella anywhere still freaks her out! 

He is only 8 months old. And probably feeling very threatened given all the strangers he has been with. Give him the benefit of the doubt. Be firm with him but without showing any aggression. I know it will be challenging, but with a little patience and a lot of love, I'm sure the both of you will be best friends soon!


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## datacan (May 15, 2011)

Please remember to set rules and stick to them. Dogs are intelligent and can easily take advantage of owners that are not consistent. 
It sounds hard, but, dogs thrive in a black and white world. They like steady and consistent owners. 
If something is allowed, it should always be allowed and vice versa. This goes for sleeping in the crate, begging at the table, walking outside. 

You may want to glance at this site http://www.clickerlessons.com/
Nothing wrong with throwing a treat in the crate, that's how the pros do it, also. 

As for treats, you could consider something like this because it can save a lot of money http://freshpet.com/product/delifreshturkeyformula/
Slice it, into cubes 1/2 inch, 3/4inch or uneven. Not too small so that the dog just swallows it, yet not too big so it chews on it for a long time.


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## texasred (Jan 29, 2012)

I don't let dogs that I don't trust on furniture. It doesn't matter if they are fear bitters or dogs that claim their space when sleeping.
The last thing I want is to be caught off guard and have the dogs mouth near my face. A bite to the hand might hurt for a little while but a bite to the face can do a lot of damage.
You need to sit down and write a set of rules.
Post it on the refrigerator and everyone that comes into contact with him follows them. Once he is used to the rules he will be a happier dog. 

Him laying awake quietly in his crate is a good thing. He is learning to be patient.


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## hipEchik (Apr 13, 2012)

Thanks all! He slept in the crate last night and waited until I let him out this morning whereupon he immediately wanted to lick my face. The rescue said they had been using a spray bottle w water in it and would spray him if he jumped on counters or chewed etc. I got one and, all I have to do is point it at him and he stops. As for the barking at me aggressively, the only common thread in the 3 incidents is that it was late in the day. I'm wondering if he was over tired or some such thing. Regardless, I am learning quite a lot in here. Thank you, thank you, thank you all! Teri and Scout

TexasRed, yes I was talking to my husband about that last night. 3 days in it is going to be hard to keep him off the couches but, I agree with you. Also, I think this may be confusing him re sleeping as he sometimes falls asleep on the couch, hence thinking it's his bed.


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## jakersmomma (Jan 3, 2010)

The blanket probably would spook him if it was around your shoulders and flowing. My boy is scared of anything that blows or flows in the wind lol!! They are pretty OCD about things. If a trash can falls over in the yard, my boy will bark at it until I pick it up. Also, if it is in the evening that he is doing this barky aggressive thing it could just be his late night hurrah. Jake, and several other V's I've read on here do their Vizsla freak out later in the evening. It's almost like they get a second wind. Are you positive the bark is agressive and not just a play with me, pay attention to me bark? Jake used to do that when he was about 6-9 months, he would do it to get my attention. I would not pay him any attention until he quit barking then upon silence, immediately treat him. I think it is absolutely fantastic of you to rescue this boy, he is very lucky.. Good luck!


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## R E McCraith (Nov 24, 2011)

Hip - when the other 2 pups from this breeder are adopted see if you can contact their new owners - It may give you a benchmark to work from - If the breeder turns any more pups over to V rescue I would report him to the ASPCA - sounds more like a backyard puppy mill! to me it looks like at 8mo he did not sell them and wanted to stop paying for their up keep


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## mswhipple (Mar 7, 2011)

HipEchik, you have already received some very good advice here... I just want to add my "kudos" to you for saving Scout. Way to go!! Also, keep in mind that it is possible that some or all of his issues might diminish or even disappear with the passage of time. Eight months is still quite young, and they chew 'til they're two. ;D


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## texasred (Jan 29, 2012)

In the past some people have changed rescue dogs names. Their thinking was if they had a tough past they didn't want anything associated with their past at their new home.
I personally have no idea if this helps them or not.


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## R E McCraith (Nov 24, 2011)

Tex is right- with positive reinforcement at that age I would change my name


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## hipEchik (Apr 13, 2012)

Well, we were doing well and then last night was ****. I ended up caving at 4:00 a.m. and let Scout out of the crate (our newest challenge) because he was exhausted and barking non stop. When do I call in a trainer? Having read the forums I thought I'd been doing well. Is it possible I went too Alpha too quickly on him?


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## born36 (Jun 28, 2011)

A pup at 8 months will challenge. You can set a rule like 'sleep in crate' and one night they might sleep away; the next night they might bark away. The important thing whether it be sleep in crate, not allowed on couch, no jumping up is being consistent and always following through.
Scout is learning the rules of his new home. He is also trying to train and condition YOU to do what he wants!!!! This is why you must never cave in, and never respond in a way other than the way you want the outcome to be. Otherwise he will know and understand that he can train you to do what he wants..
NO FEAR. If he is acting in a way that makes you feel fearful stand your ground. This doesn't mean force him into a crate or force him outside or off the couch. If means you give a command and wait him out til he does as asked. You then praise once you get the desired action. Never take a step back and always use the same command and apply the same rules. 

Consistant consistant consistant. This is double important with an adolescent!


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