# Older V not getting along with puppy



## charlie4 (Nov 21, 2012)

We have a 2 year old V we thought would love a new addition. He is very social and a lover. We decided back in August to get a female puppy. The puppy is now 4 months and we have had her for about 2 months. The older V has not taken to her. We have been patient and tried to let it happen on it's own, but now we are wondering if there is something more we should be doing. The Older V does not bite the puppy. He tolerates her and does not compete for resources (toys, treats, food, etc). Whenever the puppy comes near hi when he is playing with a toy or has a bone or is eating, he just stops what he is doing and walks away and lets her take whatever he has. We try to correct this - like with toys, we take the toy and give it back to him but he doesn't want it. We don't allow her to eat his bones or food - I have just observed that if she does come near him when he has these, he just leaves them. That part is good I guess. The part that is not is that is acts almost afraid of her. When he is laying somewhere in the house and she comes near him, he gets up like he is panicked and jumps up and moves. He will not lay near her. He is super uncomfortable in the back of the car with her - constantly pacing back and forth and does not like it when she touches him. People keep saying give them time but he isn't making progress with her. He is fine outside with her - always has been. She is getting to the age where she is starting to chase him and he likes it. At the park, she just follow him around and he seems to not mind. But in the house or in the car or close quarters, he gets freaked out. Any advice is welcome. This is not what we expected and has been depressing to all of us.


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## tknafox2 (Apr 2, 2013)

VERY Interesting behavior!!

I would be tempted to see how it plays out, What terms the Two of them come to. 
We have and old Bloodhound who accepted our pup with many reservations. But they are very good at sharing toy & daily treats. However " don't mess or touch each others food"! 
Your Older Dog sounds very tolerant, maybe it needs more personal attention, and some very personal alone time with YOU.
Once you have re-established some confidence, walk both dogs together, and do it always.
I walk Pearl and Fergy together and they have bonded through common events and interests.
When they ( either dog) see the leash, they BOTH get very excited and have ...lots of fun on a neighborhood, casual, sniff-a-lot, pee-poop, Walk.
Keep us posted!!


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## mswhipple (Mar 7, 2011)

Hi, charlie4, and welcome to the forums! I think tknafox2's advice to walk them together is solid. And since the female puppy is only four months old, time will probably take care of this. Your 2-year-old is deferring to her because she still has her "puppy license", but when that expires, he should begin to see her as an equal. My boy, Willie, behaves a lot like that with one of his visiting dog pals... He will give up a toy immediately if his pal wants it. That's really not such a bad thing. He'll be fine, but do try to spend some one-on-one time with him, so he knows he's still important.


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## MeandMy3 (Feb 27, 2013)

Welcome to the Forums! I agree with MsW - walking together will help them bond. Also - you may be surprised as the puppy ages, your older V may warm up to her as well. Our oldest lab doesn't like any dogs under 20 lbs. (she is the oldest and we have 4 dogs younger than she is) Once the pups reach that magic weight, they are all of a sudden her best friend. Your dog could just be waiting for your pup to grow up a bit. Good luck!


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## redbirddog (Apr 23, 2010)

http://redbirddog.blogspot.com/2009/12/history-and-misconceptions-of-dominance.html

Dr. Frank Beach performed a 30-year study on dogs at Yale and UC Berkeley. Nineteen years of the study was devoted to social behavior of a dog pack. (Not a wolf pack. A DOG pack.) Some of his findings:

1. Male dogs have a rigid hierarchy.
2. Female dogs have a hierarchy, but it's more variable.
3. When you mix the sexes, the rules get mixed up. Males try to follow their constitution, but the females have "amendments."
4. Young puppies have what's called "puppy license." Basically, that license to do most anything. Bitches are more tolerant of puppy license than males are.
5. The puppy license is revoked at approximately four months of age. At that time, the older middle-ranked dogs literally give the puppy **** -- psychologically torturing it until it offers all of the appropriate appeasement behaviors and takes its place at the bottom of the social hierarchy. The top-ranked dogs ignore the whole thing.
There is NO physical domination. Everything is accomplished through psychological harassment. It's all ritualistic.
6. A small minority of "alpha" dogs assumed their position by bullying and force. Those that did were quickly deposed. No one likes a dictator.
7. The vast majority of alpha dogs rule benevolently. They are confident in their position. They do not stoop to squabbling to prove their point. To do so would lower their status because...
8. Middle-ranked animals squabble. They are insecure in their positions and want to advance over other middle-ranked animals.
9. Low-ranked animals do not squabble. They know they would lose. They know their position, and they accept it.
10. "Alpha" does not mean physically dominant. It means "in control of resources." Many, many alpha dogs are too small or too physically frail to physically dominate. But they have earned the right to control the valued resources. An individual dog determines which resources he considers important. Thus an alpha dog may give up a prime sleeping place because he simply couldn't care less.


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