# Spay or not spay.. advice needed



## Luna21 (May 29, 2021)

Hello- my 8 month viz Luna is currently in first heat. Vet asked me to call her when this happened and she has asked me on the phone to book her in straight away after her first heat to be spayed. She said it was the best for the dog and reduces further health issues which I have researched. BUT I met with my trainer who also breeds dogs and she says I should let her have one litter first. We didn’t plan on breeding Luna- we just wanted a loving family pet. But trainer thinks a first litter is really good for a female dog and to do it around 2 years old. My husband is all for not getting her spayed but I think that’s because he doesn’t want her in pain- but I’m unsure as like I said I didn’t plan on breeding her and now I’m wondering what’s best for Luna. Any advice would be greatly appreciated thank you!


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## gunnr (Aug 14, 2009)

I had two females for many years. both were spayed.
In Gunnr, there was no change at all. Tika changed though. Her drive went to zero, and she was never really more than a just a wonderful family member and complete joy to be around after that. But it did change her, and I always regretted my decision with her.
Each dog will be different.


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## A-arons Kodster (Sep 2, 2018)

I vote not too* if you ever wanna breed your dogs I wouldn't. You can NEVER go back once it's done. Just like the other member said there is a chance it could change the dog in certain areas of its life. I go by.....our ancient ancestors NEVER neutered their Dogs....why should we? Your choice though....your Dog.

Sent from my SM-N975U1 using Tapatalk


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## [email protected] (Feb 24, 2020)

Hello, 

There are many people here who have had multiple Vizslas and I am sure their input will be highly valuable. I, just like you, have researched far and wide on this topic. My conclusion: it is sensitive and there is a general lack of consensus . 

Regarding the litter part, I do not think that every pup should be bred and especially taking into consideration that you have a girl, I see no reason, unless it was a path you wished to dedicate your lives and spare time towards, to breed her. Breeding means much more than having a litter: it means getting the right to mount (that means a pedigree is not enough, you must have Excellent in CAC and CACIB - idk if the titles are the same everywhere, but the hassle is identical-, which means you must show your girl in several locations - that means time, money and dedication), getting all health certificates with qualifications for each risk group (i.e. hips, congenital diseases), finding a suitable male that has all the certificates etc. (keep in mind, that the first time may not be with luck, she may reject the male, or just like humans, the intercourse may not result in pregnancy), and then you must care for your girl during pregnancy (echographs, blood tests etc), you must make sure the babies get their certificates/registration with your Kennel Club/Canine Association, they get their first two shots, you find suitable homes for each of them and if an issue may arise, you are prepared to take any of them back and rehome. That is a lot of investment and if one is not prepared to do it the right way, I for one would choose not to do it at all. Bare in mind, that as the girl is yours, all the hard work falls on you, not the family with the boy  - at least this is how things work in my patriarchal side of Europe ). And it is plenty of money, as well as sweat involved in doing this thing the right way. 

I for one, chose to wait until my pup is 2 and a half and his growth is finished - assuming that the body of literature advising to wait until the growth plates are sealed and the pup is finished growing made the most sense to me. Regarding the health benefits of spaying and not spaying - there are so many opinions, it will be up to you to choose when and if you do it. You are the one deciding what is best for your girl.


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## [email protected] (Feb 24, 2020)

Oh, and here redbirddog - a hungarian pointer (vizsla) blog, you will find a wide body of literature on the topic, aside the summary of redbirddog, perhaps it will make the decision lighter.


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## texasred (Jan 29, 2012)

If I never plan to breed them, I spay them between 2 and 3 years old. By that time they have finished growing in height, and chest width.
I always try to do the spay 3 months after a heat cycle. Less risk of complications at that time, than if you have it done close to a cycle.


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## Dan_A (Jan 19, 2021)

In all of my research this is the first time where I have ever heard that having at least one litter is best for a pup. Everything has been about having hormones for proper growth and development. I would be very skeptical about this claim. It would be a huge time commitment. Was the breeder planning on "going in on" the investment together? Then you know where the motivation comes from (money). Nothing wrong with breeding your dog , just try your best to make sure you are doing it for the right reasons and that it makes sense for the pup and you. If you find any research around having at least one litter is shown to benefit a female dog , feel free to post it here as I'd like to review it.


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## Luna21 (May 29, 2021)

Thanks very much for all your advice it’s really helped. We will wait until she is a little bigger to get her spayed. I still see her as a little puppy and don’t want to do any damage. @Dan_A as for my trainer she has bred German Shepard’s and labradors. It is a common myth many say about letting them have first litter but lots of breeders and trainers do believe this. She is no longer a breeder and would never encourage to breed for money and I wouldn’t do that anyway. We never intended on breeding Luna from the start- we have a young family and just want a happy healthy dog. Thanks everyone!


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## Zwief (May 5, 2018)

Luna21 said:


> …I didn’t plan on breeding her and now I’m wondering what’s best for Luna. Any advice would be greatly appreciated thank you!


Unless you have a compelling reason, do not breed her. Leave that to professional breeders.

I have scheduled my girl’s laparoscopic spay for next month. She will be 3.25 years old at that time.

I was in no hurry to spay her (like your husband).

at least wait until she is well and truly fully grown (18 months).

Good luck!


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## Frida010 (Apr 24, 2020)

In contrary to most people on this forum, we got Fred spayed before her first heat, in advice of vet. The advice we got was:

As we wait for a dog to reach skeletal maturity, she may go through her first estrus cycle. Then her risk for mammary cancer rises, and she must be kept away from intact male dogs so she isn’t accidentally bred. Waiting to spay also means the hassle of cleaning up after a dog in heat.

The most recent research has shown that spaying and neutering pets as puppies and kittens can affect their growth. Early spaying and neutering increases the length of time that the bones grow, which results in a taller pet. The concern is that increased growth may affect how joints align. Therefore, spaying and neutering early may not be in a pet’s best interest, especially if the animal is prone to breed-related orthopedic problems.

Fred, like her parents, is on the small side of a V’s normal height. She is healthy and we haven’t yet experienced any problems with early spaying.


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## Dan_A (Jan 19, 2021)

Also the big cancer with not spaying is mammary related. It certainly is to be of concern;however, it is very easy to monitor for on the dog and should be done monthly especially for intact females. It is quite easy to do a “breast” exam on them.

To also consider is potential behavioral changes with an early spay. This is difficult to quantify scientifically as they can do for physiological differences.


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## Frida010 (Apr 24, 2020)

Dan_A said:


> Also the big cancer with not spaying is mammary related. It certainly is to be of concern;however, it is very easy to monitor for on the dog and should be done monthly especially for intact females. It is quite easy to do a “breast” exam on them.
> 
> To also consider is potential behavioral changes with an early spay. This is difficult to quantify scientifically as they can do for physiological differences.


I have to add here that I found it very hard to really determine any behavioral changes due to Fred’s early spaying, since before her 1st year she continuously developed her behaviour. I did not notice any sudden changes right after. She has grown into a very smart and easy going girl. But that is just my experience, it might be different for others.

I think I should add that our main reason for early spaying is that we live in a big city, with many (untrained) dogs and untrained owners. For me personally, I liked not having to worry about Fred being harassed by males during heat. And it would be a lot easier for her in daycare. We don’t have dog parks but off leash areas in the neighborhood are always crowded. Fred is an easy going girl, but if a male tries to jump her she will always correct them. And she is fast like a snake, but usually one well timed correction is all it takes.


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