# Dog Park Problems



## tanners_mama (Sep 22, 2011)

So Tanner and I love going to the dog park. We go almost every night, for at least an hour after dinner. We play fetch, but most of all he LOVES chasing after other dogs. I am thankful when the other V's are there or the occasional Rhodesian Ridgeback who love to RUN!

Lately, however, there have been numerous dog owners who are very nervous with the way Tanner plays. Us V lovers know that this is just the way they play. Tanner likes to charge and tumble and chomp and make lots of noises. Never once has he actually hurt another dog. But lately I have heard complaints from other people about how "agressive" and "crazy" my dog is :'( 

I try to calm their nerves by telling them he's never had any issues with other dogs before, and he just likes to play rough, it's his nature. They just don't seem to understand :-\

How can I make the dog park a pleasant experience for everyone? I will not stop taking Tanner, I need others to understand he is just playing and is being his normal crazy ;D Vizsla self.


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## redbirddog (Apr 23, 2010)

http://redbirddog.blogspot.com/2010/05/poor-city-dogs.html



> I will not stop taking Tanner, I need others to understand he is just playing and is being his normal crazy Vizsla self.


Good luck with that. I couldn't do it anymore with my two. I'll drive 1/2 hour to find a place to walk them off-leash. If I can't then it is an hour walk along the sidewalks in town.

The down-side just outweighed the up-side for us. Maybe my introvert self doesn't help. 

http://redbirddog.blogspot.com/2012/08/hungarian-pointers-character-over.html

RBD


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## tanners_mama (Sep 22, 2011)

I had a feeling someone was going to say just that...
I'm afraid that's what it might come down to if other's continue to complain.


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## datacan (May 15, 2011)

There is a dog park not too far from where we live and sometimes the owners get into fights also ;D

Staying away from dog parks makes it less stressful and is the only real way to ease the experience. 
Unless, you feel the park is where Tanner belongs and in that case you can get together with a few "stable" dogs and their owners. For the time your group is there the offended dog owners can p**** off and go their marry way. 

Organizing into groups is the only way. 
We don't go to dog parks but have been known to take over the local urban forrest when we get together with GSPs and Vs  its quite a sight.


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## flynnandlunasmom (May 28, 2012)

I avoid dog parks like the plague. I think they're partly responsibly for Flynn's issues. He went all the time as a tiny puppy and a few times he was really scared by bigger, older aggressive dogs. It made him fearful - which developed into fear aggression. (I have no proof it was the dog parks but the behaviorist seems to think so too). 

Now, he's not great with other dogs. He's never bitten a dog or hurt one but given the chance, he has pinned them down, scared them, growled at them. It's scary for the other dog owners and I don't feel right about letting it happen. If it continues to happen it could escalate. You have to do what's best for you and your dog, but I felt too much guilty about being the parent of a dog other dogs and/or people feared so I took him out of that situation. 


Flynn has a few select dogs we know he gets along with and that's about it (and we got him a sister last year whom he now loves). Until we got our second vizsla, we felt guilty about the lack of socialization but the behaviorists said "your dog doesn't need dog friends. You are his pack." Of course, this was when he was about 3 years old, so the necessary socialization period with other dogs was already over.


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## flynnandlunasmom (May 28, 2012)

I guess another question is, are you sure it's just play for your dog and that he's not exhibiting aggression? In my case, I could tell it wasn't just normal play but in your case, it may be.


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## mswhipple (Mar 7, 2011)

Here's an idea -- Put up a real fence around your own acreage and get another Vizsla. Problem solved!! ;D ;D


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## OttosMama (Oct 27, 2011)

I keep away from parks with dogs I don't know now as well. I love getting together with other vizsla owners and their vs because 1/ all the owners I've met seem like really awesome people. 2/ they obviously understand Otto's energy and most importantly 3/ Otto seems the most comfortable amongst them


Otto would play with any dog - big, small, old, young, male, female - however, other dogs tend to dislike something about ottos personality. Quite often, he is the target and gets "bullied". It's very upsetting - so now if I don't know the owner - I don't even give it a chance. Too often, people claim their dog is "friendly" but when they approach Otto, they are anything but. So now I steer clear. 

Maybe ask the Rhodesian ridgeback's owners and other V owners if they want to meet up on trails away from the park. I would assume this would be much less stressful for you


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## texasred (Jan 29, 2012)

I just don't see my dogs having much to do in a dog park.
They mostly like to run out to the front and hunt. They will let another dog sniff them and then go on their way. To much sniffing will lead to a snap by my dogs. It means leave me alone, you interfering with my hunting.
I run them with other dogs that feel the same way.
Don't get me wrong my dogs do play sometimes, but its with dogs they know real well. Its a high speed chasing game through water.


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## SteelCityDozer (Aug 25, 2011)

OttosMama said:


> Otto would play with any dog - big, small, old, young, male, female - however, other dogs tend to dislike something about ottos personality. Quite often, he is the target and gets "bullied". It's very upsetting - so now if I don't know the owner - I don't even give it a chance. Too often, people claim their dog is "friendly" but when they approach Otto, they are anything but. So now I steer clear.


I feel the same way. I've found out when certain "good" dogs are at the park and I go then and only then. I will be very strategic about introducing penny this month to the park. Luckily our park also has a "small dog" side that is rarely used for that purpose so sometimes were able to use it to seperate two groups of dogs.


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## KB87 (Jan 30, 2012)

Ottosmama, I've found we have a similar issue with our V- he's SO friendly and loves everyone and every dog but they seem to dislike him for some reason. Even though he's 5 months he'll go up calmly to greet a dog and in no time they snap at him. It makes me sad but it doesn't seem to phase him. Luckily the only dogs he has found to play with live in our neighborhood - a rott, a mastiff and a GSP. Any dogs we've met on walks through parks or even friends dogs will snap at him. I'm hesitant to take him to a dog park for this reason. I really wish we have Vs in the area for him to play with.

Well, looks like we just might have to get another V baby in a year or two to keep him company. Darn.


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## tanners_mama (Sep 22, 2011)

flynnandlunasmom said:


> I guess another question is, are you sure it's just play for your dog and that he's not exhibiting aggression? In my case, I could tell it wasn't just normal play but in your case, it may be.


I truly think it is just playing. If it was truly agression, I would imagine he would have been kicked out of doggie daycare by now, as they have a strict policy against agressive dogs. What can I say... he's just not "gentle"


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## tanners_mama (Sep 22, 2011)

mswhipple said:


> Here's an idea -- Put up a real fence around your own acreage and get another Vizsla. Problem solved!! ;D ;D


Boy do I wish this were the case, however we are renting for the last and final year to save up for a house. Thankfully we rent a home with a nice large backyard  and when we have the opportunity we take a trip to my mom's and boyfriend's home where they have a 6 month old V and they have a riot! 

Seriously considering another one when we finally are homeowners!


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## threefsh (Apr 25, 2011)

We don't do dog parks or dog beaches because there has always been an issue with Riley playing "too rough" or other dogs attacking her for no reason (usually GSD or GSD mixes). Find some Vizslas (or compatible, high-energy hunting dogs) near you & go on some off-leash hikes!


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## laurita (Jun 12, 2011)

hi tanners_mama!

I have similar circumstances in that I live in the center of Houston, TX and taking my dog to open land isn't always feasible during the week. I take my V to the dog park and have been humbled many times by both my dog and other owners. I have found that the best solution when my dog is playing with another is by calmly telling the owner, "my dog loves to play rough. If at any point you begin to feel uncomfortable please let me know and I'll take him away." Sure enough there are owners who aren't comfortable telling you that something gives them discomfort, so when it starts getting rough, I look at the owners' body language (owning a dog has made me + i'm sure all of you very in touch with nonverbal communication) and I either go get him and take him away or check in with the owner again. In this way I feel as you don't become such a dog-park outcast! I think people get really aggravated when owners allow their dogs to be wild banshees and seem uninterested in getting involved.

PS- how old is your V? This may not be the case for you but I feel as though mine plays better as he gets older. He seems to be more respectful of other dogs at a year and 8 mos. Try to find owners that have equally active dogs and are thankful of the rowdy play. That way you both can be grateful that you found each other that night!


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## tanners_mama (Sep 22, 2011)

laurita said:


> hi tanners_mama!
> 
> I have similar circumstances in that I live in the center of Houston, TX and taking my dog to open land isn't always feasible during the week. I take my V to the dog park and have been humbled many times by both my dog and other owners. I have found that the best solution when my dog is playing with another is by calmly telling the owner, "my dog loves to play rough. If at any point you begin to feel uncomfortable please let me know and I'll take him away." Sure enough there are owners who aren't comfortable telling you that something gives them discomfort, so when it starts getting rough, I look at the owners' body language (owning a dog has made me + i'm sure all of you very in touch with nonverbal communication) and I either go get him and take him away or check in with the owner again. In this way I feel as you don't become such a dog-park outcast! I think people get really aggravated when owners allow their dogs to be wild banshees and seem uninterested in getting involved.
> 
> PS- how old is your V? This may not be the case for you but I feel as though mine plays better as he gets older. He seems to be more respectful of other dogs at a year and 8 mos. Try to find owners that have equally active dogs and are thankful of the rowdy play. That way you both can be grateful that you found each other that night!


I love your suggestion, thank you! Tanner is 13 months old now, at "that age" for sure where he thinks everyone is his best friend . I will try and word it differently next time to those that seem uneasy by his crazy tendencies.


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## luv2laugh (Oct 6, 2011)

Hello Everyone,

Oso also attracts unwanted attention at dogs parks. I'm pretty confident it is his crazy hyper energy. He stirs up the other dogs. If we are with a good group it is wonderful, but especially when he was a puppy puppy he became a target. As he has gotten older, he is still hyper, but has less crazy puppy energy and that has made a world of difference.

As for the original question....Every owner has a different definition of what "nice" play is. I think the challenge is finding a group which has the same view as you. Dog parks are a place of lots of drama. I always try to avoid it. You may want to get the phone numbers of the people with v's or ridgebacks who Tanner plays well with and meet up at another park/location. That way you don't have to feel bad and Tanner can have fun playing with dogs who play similarly. 

Best of luck!


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## dcjwlee (Jun 22, 2012)

***


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## R E McCraith (Nov 24, 2011)

Dog Park - the name says it all - a place to PARK your DOG & and think you are a good owner and let anyone that will listen tell them that - went to one in Fla - never again!


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## luv2laugh (Oct 6, 2011)

I think it really depends on the dog park and how you use them. 

We utilize the dog park as a place for Oso to socialize (not me). When we stop going to the dog park, Oso gets really excited when we see dogs on walks - when he can't say hi to them. He lunges towards them and tries to play with the leash on. It is inappropriate and often scares the other owner. Yes, we are working on this. But, the biggest preventative is providing Oso with regular socialization/play time with other dogs. If Oso has met his socialization "requirements" he can walk by nicely. 

There are other options to dog parks, but I truly think they can be a wonderful thing if used correctly. We go at off times, when it is not busy and there are few dogs. We go with the assumption that if a dog or owner is dominant/rude, etc., we will just leave. There is plenty of drama that happens at dog parks, we just don't take part in it. There are many dog parks in our vicinity and some are better than others (in dogs and people that attend).

In our area, a significant amount of people live in apartments with no yard and it is illegal in most places to hike with your dog off leash. We do hike with Oso off leash and will risk the ticket, but it's not a good place for a doggy play date. I am happy that Oso gets a chance to race around and play with other dogs at our local dog park.


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## finch (Sep 19, 2011)

Hindsight is 20/20. I am on our local dog park committee and created the Facebook page for the park, and now there are so many more people at the park whenever we go. So I find myself going to the local dog park less and less frequently these days. 

When we do go, I don't stay for as long as we used to... When Finch starts to get tired, esp now in the hot summer months, she opts for more wrestling with other dogs once she gets all her running out, and I get the impression that it makes other owners uncomfortable. She does play rough sometimes and even though she has never hurt another dog, they try to get their dogs away once she starts play-growling. She also has a tendency to bark right at a dog if she wants them to play and they don't want to... and this also makes people nervous. As soon as I see this behavior, we just leave. I can't have people thinking my CGC/Therapy Dog is a meanie!


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## tanners_mama (Sep 22, 2011)

R said:


> Dog Park - the name says it all - a place to PARK your DOG & and think you are a good owner and let anyone that will listen tell them that - went to one in Fla - never again!


What is this supposed to mean? If you are at all implying that I take my dog there because I'm lazy and don't want to do other things with him then you are very very wrong...


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## R E McCraith (Nov 24, 2011)

Tan - did not mean you - you and others brought up the problem of owners that show up at the parks with ill trained dogs - no intention of 100% watching the pup - are there to socialize them selves and not their pup - how do you even know all the dogs are even current on their shots - PS if I meant you I would have put your name on my post - hope I still have a right to my opinion!


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## tanners_mama (Sep 22, 2011)

Of course, just needed you to explain further...
Most of the people who bring their pups to our park do seem rather "lazy" however not very social. My issue is how to defend my dog when someone makes a comment that relates to his energy level. 

I appreciate everyone's responses and will be more forthcoming to others and let them know I will "control" my dog if necessary. But more importantly it looks like I need to find more off leash areas or get another V... Oh boy!


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## R E McCraith (Nov 24, 2011)

Tan - you have a V - make no excuses - if the park is the only place to go - look for pups and owners you like - set a early time to meet - the park my dog people are to lazy to be there - good luck - also look for pointer clubs in your area - they know where your pup can run free and hunt


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## city_dog (Feb 16, 2012)

I always took Sammy to the park early in the morning for an hour or more. 6am sees very few people out and about that are looking for the social aspect of the dog park.... Ever since she contracted Papillovirus in her mouth though (likely from picking up chewed sticks left behind by a careless owner, or one that just doesn't care that they're spreading disease) we do not go to the off-leash park anymore, but to the local soccer field since we can't be around other dogs until this goes away 
I agree with R E - make no excuses for your dog. A V is a very different breed from anything else and MOST people don't understand that.


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## luv2laugh (Oct 6, 2011)

Hi Tanners Mama,

I just re-read your original post. If people were telling me my dog was aggressive, I would take a hard look at his behavior instead of try to make excuses or internally think that my dog is a V and plays differently. 

Oso is a crazy hyper vizsla, but since we do have to utilize dog parks, I know he has to play a certain way. Every time he plays, it's a training experience. He gets corrections during play (verbal or with water bottle spray) and has had time outs. It takes consistency, but makes for safer play at the dog park. Oso got stitches awhile ago because a very nice dog was playing too aggressively and was trying to take him down. I was nervous with their play, but still let it happen and Oso got hurt. I don't anymore. 

Some people have no idea what they are talking about in terms of dogs and you can't pay heed to everyone. If you are noticing a theme, however, maybe Tanner's play isn't appropriate for the dog park. There is a difference between a bite and aggressive play. Aggressive play leads to injuries and I think those dogs don't belong at a dog park. If they are, they should wear a muzzle. We just leave if we see a dog playing too aggressively or go to another part of the park (if it's a large park). 

If you can find a group of owners that are all fine with that play, then it's no problem. 

**I know that is a little strong and there is a good possibility that Tanner plays just fine and the people around you are uninformed.


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## tanners_mama (Sep 22, 2011)

R said:


> Tan - you have a V - make no excuses - if the park is the only place to go - look for pups and owners you like - set a early time to meet - the park my dog people are to lazy to be there - good luck - also look for pointer clubs in your area - they know where your pup can run free and hunt


Great suggestion, much appreciated - thank you!


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## tanners_mama (Sep 22, 2011)

luv2laugh said:


> Hi Tanners Mama,
> 
> I just re-read your original post. If people were telling me my dog was aggressive, I would take a hard look at his behavior instead of try to make excuses or internally think that my dog is a V and plays differently.


I do not think I was trying to make any excuses here, simply looking for input on how others handle dog park drama and what has/hasn't worked for them. I do not let him have free run at the park nor do I think he is an angel by any means. He gets time outs as well or I will simply remove him from the activity and have him focus on something else.


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## Ozkar (Jul 4, 2011)

TM, I agree with REM. Vizslas do have a certain style of play that is both vocal at times and also fairly physical and sometimes it just doesn't gel with other dogs/breeds. 

I always gravitate towards other Vizslas first, then Pointers, Ridgebacks and Boxers where possible as they have similar styles of playing and tend to get less issues from both the dogs and the owners. Matter of fact, most owners of these breeds are normally very appreciative to have a dog which plays in a similar manner.


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## tanners_mama (Sep 22, 2011)

Good news... Was daring and went to the park this morning. Minutes after being there a couple who came in with their 16 month old female Braque français (a French pointer) and they were fantastic together!! They were very appreciative to Tanners play because their Brooke plays very similarly. 

Ozkar you hit the nail on the head


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## SteelCityDozer (Aug 25, 2011)

We took penny to the park this morning for the first time. The gentles dogs
I've ever met were arriving at the same time so I was happy about our timing. The problem, they are three Irish wolfhounds which needless to say tower over Dozer (2 yo) let alone 4 mo Penny. So she was timid but had all positive interactions. When I saw a dog arriving that I don't like, we left. Making Penny's first trip to the park a success.


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## jld640 (Sep 29, 2010)

Glad to hear you found a French pointer for Tanner! Hopefully your schedules will let them play often!

Going back to your original post, though, if you find some of the people who have expressed concern who are also reasonable, you might ask them for some more detail. 
I have had to end some play sessions when Savannah started tucking her tail and running from other dogs. Some of the owners were just useless. Others legitimately wanted to know what I was seeing to stop the play. As soon as I pointed out her tucked tail and her other body language, they thanked me for the info, and gave their dogs a time-out. The play session started again, this time with both of us keeping the intensity within bounds for all the dogs. 

For the truly useless owners, nothing you say will help. For the merely uninformed, your willingness to listen to their concerns and explain the dog body language you see may generate the ‘pleasant experience for everyone’ you are seeking.


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## tanners_mama (Sep 22, 2011)

jld640 said:


> Glad to hear you found a French pointer for Tanner! Hopefully your schedules will let them play often!
> 
> Going back to your original post, though, if you find some of the people who have expressed concern who are also reasonable, you might ask them for some more detail.
> I have had to end some play sessions when Savannah started tucking her tail and running from other dogs. Some of the owners were just useless. Others legitimately wanted to know what I was seeing to stop the play. As soon as I pointed out her tucked tail and her other body language, they thanked me for the info, and gave their dogs a time-out. The play session started again, this time with both of us keeping the intensity within bounds for all the dogs.
> ...


Thank you for this! Yes, I always try and keep a close eye on play and look at the body language. I do have a question though... Do dogs know when another dog does NOT want to play with them? I would think that they would have that understanding, however that might be one of our issues. Or is it more of a dominating act, when one dog continually tries to play with another, but the other is not interested and trying to get away, etc.


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## redbirddog (Apr 23, 2010)

> I do have a question though... Do dogs know when another dog does NOT want to play with them? I would think that they would have that understanding, however that might be one of our issues. Or is it more of a dominating act, when one dog continually tries to play with another, but the other is not interested and trying to get away, etc.


I'll take a stab at the question TM. One on one, there is a dynamic that is different then when there is a pack. Hungarian Pointers, in the DNA, still are hunters (most hunting type dogs) and some pack behavior can come out more dramatically after a dog that is designated the "prey" is created in the dog park. The chased dog may want to change from the fun of being chased to the fear of being "taken down" very quickly. You noticed it in the tail down. The other dogs prey drive may take over at some point and the group could cause damage to the dog that was the prey. 

One on one it, from what I understand, could be anything from domination to annoyance. Depends on the dogs, the conditions, the health of the dogs, if they are hungry, do they have "history" with each other, etc.

We still don't do dog parks. Thank goodness I have options, but I understand not every one does. When I walk down to the school yard where people take there dogs off-leash, I will see which dogs are there before I unleash my two dogs. If there is a strange dog, I will leave my two on leash and watch for a bit to see how they play with other dogs and then go talk to the owner first about how there dog deals with high octane dogs. If in doubt then we just walk on the sidewalks for an hour or so.

Yesterday's walk (2 hours away):

http://redbirddog.blogspot.com/2012/08/hidden-treasure-byrne-milliron-forest.html

Well worth the effort.

RBD


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## lilyloo (Jun 20, 2012)

This is slightly off topic but I don't think it warrants a new thread.

How young is too young for a first dog park experience? Ruby is 14 weeks old and I really want to take her out to a nearby dog park. It's never crowded and is on 5 acres, complete with a swimming area for the dogs. 

She's had 3 sets of shots with just one more to go.

Any input is appreciated.


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## SteelCityDozer (Aug 25, 2011)

She's probably not allowed until after her rabies if the park is regulated. I'd wait until a week or two after then anyhow.


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## tanners_mama (Sep 22, 2011)

redbirddog said:


> > I do have a question though... Do dogs know when another dog does NOT want to play with them? I would think that they would have that understanding, however that might be one of our issues. Or is it more of a dominating act, when one dog continually tries to play with another, but the other is not interested and trying to get away, etc.
> 
> 
> I'll take a stab at the question TM. One on one, there is a dynamic that is different then when there is a pack. Hungarian Pointers, in the DNA, still are hunters (most hunting type dogs) and some pack behavior can come out more dramatically after a dog that is designated the "prey" is created in the dog park. The chased dog may want to change from the fun of being chased to the fear of being "taken down" very quickly. You noticed it in the tail down. The other dogs prey drive may take over at some point and the group could cause damage to the dog that was the prey.
> ...


Thanks for this RBD - definitely makes sense. This morning I took just Tanner, not Tanner and Jane. Things were much different. Tanner didn't have his "back up" and when two other dogs (brothers) ganged up on him he didn't like it one bit. Tis must be your related to how they act in a pack. Since he didn't have his "pack" with him, his fear level was much higher.


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