# Hunting for non-hunters



## VictoriaW (Mar 16, 2011)

Just wondering...how many of you have been introduced to hunting *because* of your Vizsla?

How did you get started, how did you learn, and what do you get out of it?

To put this in context, I'm a Massachusetts gal. No one in my immediate or extended family hunts or owns guns. My friends do not hunt or own guns. My father (now gone) last touched a gun during the Korean War. To be perfectly honest, I have a healthy fear of guns (be nice to me!). 

And yet, here I have an amazing Vizsla, born and bred to hunt. My husband is taking her nearly every week to lessons with a pointing trainer recommended by our breeder. The guy is extremely enthusiastic about her. They are working on puppy stuff -- pointing, learning to whoa. We are told she is a quick learner with great instincts, although maybe he says that to all of the proud puppy parents. : She will take a NAVHDA natural abilities test this summer (the nearest test is in Maine). You can see where all of this is going!

How far along this path can we take our girl before we take the plunge and learn how to own and operate guns ourselves? And when we reach that point, where do we start? 

Please note that I have huge respect for seasoned hunters. I do not object to hunting when what is killed is used for food. We just have a big learning curve and a certain amount of ambivalence about gun ownership. Please don't laugh...I'm learning & growing along with my pup. I would love to learn from all of you.

With thanks,
Victoria


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## redbirddog (Apr 23, 2010)

Victoria,
You are where I was just three years ago. Follow my blog from 2009. I had never owned a gun and had only shot a .22 back as a boy scout at targets.

I never owned a gun but did know friends that did. Went hunting, as a spectator, for the first time in 2008 when Chloe was 4 months old. Screwed her up good and made her gun shy. Didn't have a clue what I was doing. A 4 month old Vizsla chasing a older lab as 4 guys with their 12 gauge shot guns opened up on a pheasant.

I started my blog back in June of 2009 for the exact purpose of giving folks like you and your husband a road map into this wonderful life.

I'll answer any questions happily. But now I got home, having a quick beer and off in the Jeep to run the dogs in the hills until sunset.

Maybe these two posts will give you a feel.

http://redbirddog.blogspot.com/2009/11/pheasant-hunt-opening-day.html

and 11 months later:

http://redbirddog.blogspot.com/2010/10/final-post-about-sd-written-on-way-back.html

_Life is not the breaths you take but the moments that take your breath away._
RBD


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## texasred (Jan 29, 2012)

Our Texas Parks and Wildlife Department has programs to help people wanting to get outdoors including hunting. Your state may also. I went on an all women's goose hunt this year with them. Three of the nine women had hunted before. They held a workshop class, then a shotgunning class. Then it was a guided hunt. Next month they are having a womens Upland hunt.


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## Ozkar (Jul 4, 2011)

It's funny Texas Red to hear that your parks and wildlife service runs courses to encourage hunting. Here in Oz all too often, the Hunting fraternity are all earmarked as ******** and yokels who go out get pissed and kill any living thing they can. They actively discourage them entering the state forests where it is legal to hunt. 

During Hunting seasons, the police set up road blocks leading into all the hunting areas and will crawl all over your vehicle until they find some reason to issue you an infringement notice for a stupid thing, like a torn mudflap, or a loose sunvisor!! They literally harass them in an attempt to stop them coming back. Which in reality is stupid, as we have introduced Deer that are breeding rampantly in the mountains and destroying all the native animals food sources. So to me, they should be hunted to extinction here in Oz. Why they try and discourage the Hunters is all to do with the "Green" movement over here, which is strong, vocal and powerful. 

It has become illegal to kill a Kangaroo, even if you own a property and they are destroying your livestock's food source, you now need to apply to the govt for a culling licence and then employ a licensed Kangaroo Culler. The real problem is, that due to the green movement and our recent abundance of water (Our drought broke two years ago and it hasn't stopped raining since) the buggers are in plague proportions. 

Property owners are having to be very careful in how they cull. They tend to band together, watch where the rangers are at and communicate when it is safe to cull and dispose of the carcass'. A good mate of mine had to do it covertly last week. Waits for the local ranger to be 50klms away, does what he has to, destroys the evidence, all before a Ranger can get back to the property to check. Bloody silly.

As to Victoria's OP. I agree and am in a similiar position, except that I have hunted before, but not with anything other than fox terriers for Rabbits. So am interested in hearing hte process too.


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## redbirddog (Apr 23, 2010)

Ozkar,

Being a hunter in the Bay Area makes me one of a small fraternity. We are out numbered 50 to 1 by those who find this activity obnoxious and brutal. But with the huge population of the state, there are still 10's of thousands of hunters. 

I gave up trying to explain why I took up hunting at 55 years old to any of my fellow citizens. I just live as a minority here in SICK PEA GREEN state of CALIFORNIA.

For those in other states, listen to Ozkar and what happens. It isn't that far off. You can see it in my state easily enough.

Texas is one of a handful of states that I would seriously consider moving to. Thousands of feed up Californians have. When my choice of dog, gun, home, car, electrical use, recreation, entertainment to such a degree that "the good of the state" is more important than "the good of the individual", then my days here are short.

This is in a State WAY IN DEBT. Our country's version of Greece.

OK. Now we can get back to dogs. Had a great training session this afternoon. Chloe and Bailey treed something on our hill walk. I thought. "ok, if I walk up to the tree, they lead me. I don't want whatever is in that tree." So I walked on slowly on the trail. I heard them barking. Before I got out of sight I gave them one toot on my whistle, which means "come here."
They didn't come but kept barking at the tree. I walked on. Now I am out of sight. 3 minutes pass, 4 minutes, 5 minutes. Finally Chloe comes up panting from excitement. She sees me and turns back away for the tree. I continue slowly walking. 4 more minutes. Chloe comes running up. A minute later Bailey comes running up. I did not acknowledge that they were even gone. I just kept walking and they moved ahead of me where I wanted them. I am my dog's pack leader. They go where I tell them to. By the end of the walk, they were in the heel position with no lead. They got the idea. Lesson for them and win for me. It was tough not seeing them for almost 10 minutes but it is their job to know where I am.

http://redbirddog.blogspot.com/2012/02/who-is-leading-whom.html

Sorry, but sometimes I just wish they would just leave reasonable and responsible people alone.

Off my soapbox.

RBD


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## R E McCraith (Nov 24, 2011)

RBD have U tried this for Chole-start with a freind & a 410-have him start 100yds behind where U set a bird-when Chole is on point drop your hand and friend fires-if Chole turns off point towards the gun set a few more birds without shooting - try again-every time Chole ignores the gun have your freind move 25yds closer & start again & do it again-hopefully Chole will be more interested in the bird and not the gun-U can also use a starter pistol but I like my pups to assocciate shotguns with fun-stay as close 2 the pup as you can when shes on point-not cheap if it takes a lot of quail to break her to gun but worth a try-let me know if you try it-I live in Kentucky and alot of people hunt-never hear any complaints-maybe because we have the guns-LOL


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## zigzag (Oct 4, 2011)

I am with you in your course, I have never hunted, no one in my family hunts. Although I was introduced to Fly Fishing by my father at a young age. With that came camping and backpacking trips throughout the state of California for the first 25yrs of my life. I then moved to Oregon to fly fish for the elusive Steelhead. Now through a natural progression my passion for the outdoors and sporting adventures has brought me to own A Vizsla and shotgun, My family was not so encouraging about my purchasing of a gun. I agree with reddog so many stereotypes of hunters coming from liberal states. I have found that in Oregon where I reside now. The long honored traditions of hunting and fishing are still upheld by the powers that be. ODFW has been a great resource to me. I think you will find that once you scratch the surface and begin to see the tradition behind the dogs, guns and wildlife. You will find the art in it all. Good luck.


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## texasred (Jan 29, 2012)

I found a picture of the goose hunt.


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## Mischa (Feb 17, 2010)

We're in the same boat.
We bought a Vizsla for everything we read about their agility and loving nature. We knew they were hunting dogs, but didn't realize all of what that meant. I hadn't planned on any hunt style training because I had no idea what "pointer" even meant until we got her!

Crazy Kian got us on to some field training when Mischa was about 6 months old. She did ok with it, but didn't really shine until she spent 2 weeks with our trainer while we were on vacation. She was 1 year old then. 
She did really well at the Junior level of trials, so we continued on and are looking forward to working with her for the next level of field trials. 

I have a few friends who are into guns and hunting, and the more I blab about it with them, and Crazy Kian, and you guys on here... the more I want to get into bird hunting. I figure the dog is young and I have lots of time, but I see myself more and more excited about it as time goes on. 
I'm not set on buying a shotgun just yet, but wouldn't be surprised if I got one before the year is over. 


-Dennis


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## gunnr (Aug 14, 2009)

Victoria

I'm due south of you in Ct.

I will tell you that you never have to learn to hunt if you don't want to. There is also no reason to laugh, because we all had to start somewhere.
As a graduate of the school of Zen Buddhism and the M-14 ( NATO .308 Round Rifle ), courtesy of the US Navy, people that don't have a healthy respect of firearms scare me the most.
The oldest Vizsla clubs in the US are in Mass and CT. There are many, many fun runs, trials, tests, and meets. Some shooting, most non shooting.
At a shooting test there are "designated guns", You don't shoot, they do.
At the NAVDHA Test, you will see the format.
As for the gun, she needs to start very soon, because they will shoot over her at the Test in Maine, which used to be held on the Merry Meeting Bay. Talk to your trainer.


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## texasred (Jan 29, 2012)

R said:


> RBD have U tried this for Chole-start with a freind & a 410-have him start 100yds behind where U set a bird-when Chole is on point drop your hand and friend fires-if Chole turns off point towards the gun set a few more birds without shooting - try again-every time Chole ignores the gun have your freind move 25yds closer & start again & do it again-hopefully Chole will be more interested in the bird and not the gun-U can also use a starter pistol but I like my pups to assocciate shotguns with fun-stay as close 2 the pup as you can when shes on point-not cheap if it takes a lot of quail to break her to gun but worth a try-let me know if you try it-I live in Kentucky and alot of people hunt-never hear any complaints-maybe because we have the guns-LOL


With Chloe being gun shy for so many years and thunder storm shy too, I would probably just let her enjoy the finer things in life without causing her stress. She could still run the fields and point birds without gunfire.
I'm a soft hearted person and have been known to put birds in a field for a dog that will never be hunted over.
The dog belongs to a friend and is extremely noise shy. I invite him and his dog out to chase a few birds that we plant. The dog is in heaven with no stress. After him and his dog leave I turn out mine and hunt over them.

There are some Cd's called the Masters Voice that Ive heard some good reviews on but have never tried.
If anyone has a dog that scared of Thunder storms, fireworks or gun fire it maybe something worth trying.


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## redbirddog (Apr 23, 2010)

TexasRed.



> There are some Cd's called the Masters Voice that Ive heard some good reviews on but have never tried.


Is there a link you could share. Yes Chloe will never be hunted over. One dog one hunter is something that runs through many of the gun dog books I have read. Bailey is my hunter. We have that bond. Chloe and Bailey get to run off leash every evening and twice on Saturday "hunting" to their hearts content.

*Master's Voice. * I like the sound of that.

RBD


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## texasred (Jan 29, 2012)

Heres the link.
http://www.mastersvoice-dog.com/


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## redbirddog (Apr 23, 2010)

Tried it and gave up early (after 2 weeks) when I choose not to make her a gun dog. 

I think I still have the CDs if anyone would like them..

RBD


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## VictoriaW (Mar 16, 2011)

A big thank you to everyone who replied to my original post. I appreciate the wise and welcoming advice.

On Saturday, I tagged along with my husband and Gracie to meet her trainer for the first time.

Oh.

THAT'S why we're doing this!

This was Gracie's sixth training session. She is a few days shy of 8mo. She LOVES it (started whining in the car a mile away from the trainer's house). It was just incredible to see her out there doing what she was bred to do. I was impressed by how much relationship building is involved, by how much this training is developing her self-control. Eye-opening all around.

So, I think we'll kick the gun decision a couple of years into the future...maybe take some gun safety courses in the meantime (they are offered by MA Dept of Fish & Wildlife, thanks for the suggestion). But whether we become hunters ourselves or not, we will keep training our girl to do what she so obviously loves best. 

Just look!


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## redbirddog (Apr 23, 2010)

> Oh.
> THAT'S why we're doing this!


http://redbirddog.blogspot.com/2010/10/hunt-for-dog-or-dog-for-hunt.html

I remember that feeling. It took on a life of it's own after that. Hold on and enjoy the ride.

Vizsla. Not a dog - A lifestyle.

RBD


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## R E McCraith (Nov 24, 2011)

one of the meanings of hunt is to search and find - this is a V's breeding - no need to take a gun - the hunting season is not much time compared to a year - what's fun for PIKE any time of the year and me is to go to the club for fun trials- time held on point (cut off is 2min-so we all get 2 play) big nose(dog wins that is the furthest from a set bird) bumper drills(hold back drop on 2 or 3 bumpers) distance jumping in the pond etc- at the end of the day Pike has no idea who won or lost he just had fun like I did ! The other side of the coin is put on the hunting cloths grab a shot gun and PIKE knows we are going for birds I belive that is when he is at his best!


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