# Destructive Separation Behaviour



## NutterButter (Mar 5, 2016)

We are just about at our wits end with our 7 year old "rescue Vizsla" (Sadie) who we have had for about 3 months now.

-All our dogs have spent the night in a garage shop area with water and dog beds, with no problems. Sadie did just fine in a dog crate to start out, but then after about 2 weeks ripped the door out of a crate designed for 90 lbs dogs (she is a 45 pounder and very fit and strong). She was in the room with a very mellow and older male American Fox Hound who loves her and you would think might be a calming influence.
-We then let her sleep in the crate but without a door, and she was fine for 2 weeks. Then started destructive behavior that tore apart everything in the sleep area and knocked everything off of shelves or toppled over things, and then chewed half way through the door.
-We then let her sleep on the sofa in the house, and she would sleep through the night with no problems, but now wakes us up a couple of times a night to go outside.
-We also installed a dog door so she can go in and out of the house at will (except at night because of coyotes). She stays wherever we are though.
-So, that is some of the background, now down to the latest problem. She had been OK with us being gone for a few hours (again, with dog door access to the house), but recently while we were out, she got up on every shelf and countertop in the house and knocked items off plus spread papers and documents and books all about. She also went in the garage and climbed on the cars and knocked a few items off of shelves. Nothing chewed at least. We know from experience she will rip screens down if we lock her out of the house, or run off while despite an "invisible fence" which she generally respects otherwise.
-She gets plenty of exercise every day running hard for about a mile twice a day off leash.
-We can't go on with the destructive behavior and are now looking for a qualified adopter, preferably southern California, much as we love her. 
-We are going to also try some meds that the veterinarian says may help anxiety and "OCD" so we will see. Any ideas including placement suggestions would be much appreciated.


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## texasred (Jan 29, 2012)

Send a email to Vizsla Rescue Haven, and ask for some advise on ways to help with her anxiety.


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## Vizsla Baby (Nov 4, 2011)

If you are looking for a home for her, please put her in a Vizsla rescue. They'll find someone who is home all day who can take her. We are home 95% of the time with our two Vizsla's because we work from home. There are plenty of folks like us out there. 

Poor girl, her first owner must have been just awful for her. My daughter adopted a weim who had similar issues. About 1 1/2 years later, he's so much better but he still chews their blinds sometimes. (they're on their 5th set I think) 

Good luck and maybe she'll take a turn for the better very soon.


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## NutterButter (Mar 5, 2016)

Thanks for the suggestions. We will only let her go to a good home or highly regarded Vizsla Rescue, accompanied by a donation of course. Reading some of the posts, at least we are not alone. My mom had a couple of Vizslas that grew up on our cattle ranch, and they were a bit quirky but not destructive ever that I remember (one used to chase reflections and flashlight beams). Regarding being at home 95% of the time, we are mostly home too but it is the 5% that at least one of us is not home that is the concern. Right now she is curled up on her pad next to my desk as well behaved as you can imagine. She is glued to my side though when I get up, and sits as close as possible to me when I am working in the garage. Our previous dogs liked to be with us, but would go off and explore on their own too and I wish she would, she clearly likes our big American Fox Hound, so why she won't hang out more with him is curious. Her latest favorite night time sleeping spot is burrowed in to a deep corner of a closet instead of on the sofa, so it is something different every couple of weeks with her.

Regarding the "Weim" who is now better, was it just a matter of daily routines in a stable environment that eventually led to better behavior, or was there something more intensive required ?


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## CrazyCash (Jul 12, 2012)

My gut says that she's having a hard time feeling safe and comfortable that she's truly "home". If she's 7 and you've had her for 3 months, do you know how many homes she had before you? My dogs are both rescues and have been VERY destructive in the past. Now for the most part they are fine and can be left alone in the house without any problems. It sounds to me like she might have too much freedom when you are gone - she's wandering around looking for you or looking for something to do. Your home is still new to her, so she's probably a little uncomfortable. Have you tried leaving her in a crate in the house when you are gone (maybe with the radio on so she doesn't feel completely alone)? If she's sleeping in the closet, then try covering her crate so it's dark and she has a safe place. If you don't want to try the crate in the house, I would limit the number of rooms that she has access to, keep her in a smaller space. If you can, I'd give her some more time to adjust. It sounds like she's attached to you and just needs a little more time to get used to everything else.


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## NutterButter (Mar 5, 2016)

Since a picture can be worth many words, here is when she busted out of her crate after being just fine overnight for the first two weeks we had her. This was a tidy work shop the day before.

She was owned by an elderly lady for several years, and apparently had one or two litters prior to that (i.e. at a very young age). The lady would feed her table scraps as well as dog food and according to vet records she weighed 55 lbs (her now healthy and fit weight is 44 lbs). When the lady could no longer care for her, the grandson who had never owned a dog took her for a few months, and she was destructive when left in his house, but most of the time he would take her to the office with him and she was fine there, that is where we came in to the picture.


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## texasred (Jan 29, 2012)

That's comparable to some of the pictures crazycash posted in the past. ;D
Along with the damage to your home, I would be concerned with her hurting herself. 
The reason I mentioned you contacting vizsla rescue haven, is they are some vizslas last hope. They work with hard to place Vs, and ones that will never be adopted. Years of experience, rather than what has worked with a dog, or two. 
In the meantime you might want to look into a Thunder jacket, along with a DAP collar or in spray form. 
Right now, it's not safe to leave her out when your away, but I think you already know this.


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## Vizsla Baby (Nov 4, 2011)

Regarding the Weim, there was nothing professional done, my SIL just worked with him - based on your picture there was nowhere near the extreme destruction. I feel for you, I know you love her.


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## NutterButter (Mar 5, 2016)

I just picked up a prescription of Clomocalm from the veterinarian, so we will see if that works. There were some other meds that might help too, but they were 6 times the cost.

I suppose we could convert a room to a "padded cell" with piped in classical music for when we are gone from the house. ; )

Right now she is wagging her butt off pouncing on our American Fox Hound who stands there slowly wagging his tail through the whole ordeal including the neck chewing part, he is so patient....I hope the meds don't impact her playful behavior.

Since she stresses out our dogsitter we will try boarding Sadie this weekend, nice individual sleeping pens with no sharp edges and big area for supervised play. Fingers crossed that goes OK.


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## CrazyCash (Jul 12, 2012)

If this makes you feel any better, here are some pictures from my dogs destruction...you are not alone. 




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## NutterButter (Mar 5, 2016)

That helps to know we are not alone. Here is another photo of "the major incident". What made my heart almost stop was to see the grinder and wire wheel going full speed and no dog in sight. She was wedged between the wall and the toolbox on the left, shivering and with only one minor scrape on a paw. you can bet that all power tools are unplugged at all times now. Again, this was a nice and tidy shop the day before........

I got her out from behind the toolbox and bundled her up in a blanket and held her for awhile which resulted in much face licking and then on about her business as though all was well. Meanwhile at the other end of the stress spectrum was the Fox Hound who was sound asleep under a pile of debris including somehow the door to her dog crate. How she was able to completely remove that door is still beyond my comprehension.


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## NutterButter (Mar 5, 2016)

Found this link that TexasRed had posted on another location. Good information.

http://pets.webmd.com/dogs/separation-anxiety-dogs?page=6


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## texasred (Jan 29, 2012)

This book also comes highly recommended by people dealing with the same issues.

http://www.patriciamcconnell.com/store/I-ll-Be-Home-Soon.html


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## gingerling (Jun 20, 2015)

She needs to be in a crate. You're giving her way too much freedom, your expectations aren't realistic. Take a step back here and pretend she's an 8 week old you've just brought home, except she has issues and a history to work thru.

I like the idea of meds...I know that freaks people out, especially head meds...I'd go with the best one out there, I know you choose Clomocalm on price...but you want to fix this as fast as you can, and typically the heavy hitters are the best and fastest way to go. 

The idea with meds is to decouple their association of "Alone" with "Terror". So, you give them the pill, they chill, and "Feel" differently when you're gone, they have a different emotional experience to the event of being left alone. Over a period of time, they no longer associate your absence with that terrified feeling. And then, you stop the meds. The 'All natural" potions that promise to sorta work make us feel better b/c they're not strong meds, but b/c the results in SEVERE anxiety (like hers) are spotty at best, you end up having to keep her on them longer, and not only isn't it all that effective, it's more expensive in the long run than the "real" meds.

When she's properly medicated and crate trained, we can talk about the garage and outside pens. But right now, it might be best to see this as a medical issue that needs proper medicine, and when she's stabilized on that, you can take the next step. There's simply no reason based on your description to believe that she'll do better (or even tolerate) the garage/pen plan, no matter how well intended or constructed. Remember, she's a rescue for a reason, if this was something that could be more easily addressed, her prior owner would have done it.

What you're describing is fairly serious and should be responded to with the strongest and most effective medication out there, I'm sorry, I personally don't think there are short cuts.


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## NutterButter (Mar 5, 2016)

Just an update. Not sure whether it is the Clomicalm or just that she has finally made the transition from being a city dog to a country dog, but she has been on her best behavior for some time now. She sleeps through the night (on her bed in the living room) with no issues, comes when called, willingly and enthusiastically goes on walks (more like running full speed) off leash, and stays with us when we are working outside without being "in our face". I was worried that the medication might make her lethargic, but she still has boundless energy, just directed like a "regular dog" now.

When we leave she stays outside with our Fox Hound, with access to an open dog crate, and I leave the door open to my old truck. She seems quite happy with this arrangement, and has not tried to get into the house or garage while we are out.


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## NutterButter (Mar 5, 2016)

Just another update since it has been quite a while. Everything good, with a routine that works. No destructive behavior in many months.

-For trips away from the house, we leave her dog door open with access to the house or outdoors with our Fox Hound.
-When we leave for the day or dinner out for example, we also give her a shoe box containing a rawhide bone, and a toy with treats inside. The rawhide bone is a favorite of hers, and she only gets it while we are out.
-We found a great dogsitter who understands Sadie and her need for exercise, attention, and affection.

Although she is certainly a challenge, she is a great dog. Gets me up at the crack of dawn to go out, side benefit is that I have experienced lots of gorgeous sunrises.

Cheers and thanks for the advice.


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## NutterButter (Mar 5, 2016)

Sadie's typical morning start. Sit by the bed with an occasional wiggle and quiet whimper to let me know it is time to get up so I don't miss the sunrise.


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## Mike Waddell (Jul 14, 2016)

So happy to read the end of this thread, NutterButter. I've adopted a 5 year old gem of a Vizsla that has settled in very nicely in the first month of being with us. I read through a lot of threads like this because I was worried it might happen here as well, and the suggestions were great to have in my back pocket.

Glad it is working better now!


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## MCD (May 4, 2013)

These dogs are very smart and have a good memory once something has stuck. Dharma has figured out how to open her wire bar crate and has escaped a few times. Yes she chews paper, yes she has chewed the handle of a pair of scissors and yes she knows how to open the cupboard which houses the garbage can. I consequently put her in a crate similar to Sadie's......... She moved her crate 360 degrees and cut her nose up quite badly. I feel so bad now. I have since taken some WD40 and sprayed the hinges on the wire crate so they move better and I have taken pliers and tightened all of the clips where the crate closes. Luckily Dharma hasn't gotten out since I did this. The type of crate apparently makes a difference in this case.


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## NutterButter (Mar 5, 2016)

MCD- We actually gave up on the crate for Sadie many months ago. She figured out how to open in all though I still cannot see how as you need to simultaneously move two levers in opposite directions from the outside. I then tried tying the release levers and she destroyed the heavy wire metal door. This was not a light gage steel so pretty crazy that she permanently bent it enough to spring it open. Nowadays she sleeps on a dog bed on our sofa in the house, and has full access to the house and yard (via her dog door) while we are out. As I said, everything good with that for many months now. We work mostly from home, and I even though this routine works I would worry about leaving her all day every day.


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