# Puppies galore!



## doublemocha

I thought that I would try and post some pictures of the puppies just a few hours old that the breeder has sent. Awww


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## doublemocha

They were just amazing when I met them!

Trying to think of names, suggestions welcome (boy) And I will be asking lots of questions!


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## harrigab

if I had a boy I'd call him "Mint" as thats the river that runs right past the house where I grew up, it's also the river that I fish for salmon 
pups are gorgeous ;D


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## doublemocha

Last one, I have more!


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## doublemocha

Took me ages to figure uploads, had I bloomin' read the instructions properly, it would have taken minutes!


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## flynnandlunasmom

I'm a big fan of the name Enzo after reading "The Art of Racing in the Rain".

If our (human) baby is a boy, his middle name will be Enzo and that's what we'll call him. 

Congrats on the pup! Great pictures.


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## doublemocha

I like Enzo! Although, I can't get Zippy out of my head but that's not a very dignified name is it?! Mint is good too but I just know hubby will question that.

Also - Ritson, Ritz for short, Pip, and Oscar and liked by all and Drinan (which is the name of the small cottage we stay at in Scotland and has wonderful memories for us)

Our friends are donating a crate that they used for their Lab when he was younger, assume this will be around the correct size. Our friends with the Vizsla advise ear plugs and being tough, for the greater good!!


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## SkyyMax

The puppies are so cute!!!

We picked up the names for all of our 3 V boys prior to meeting them, but at home decided on completely different name (every time), because it seemed to fit better 

Good luck with your new V baby!


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## SerCopper

My son has already picked a name for our second pup...I am reading him a book called Shiloh about a boy and his dog and he thinks it is fitting for our next boy...


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## pippylongstocking

Lovin the name zippy! My current favourite is moose.


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## doublemocha

I think I agree SkyyMax, we will pick something completely different!

Shiloh is lovely, are you in the process of getting a second puppy SerCopper?

I love Moose! I seem to be drawn to 'fun' names. Current favourite in the household last night was Ronnie 

I have a ton of questions, so was thinking of not bombarding you all but starting from the beginning!

The puppies will be ready at 8 weeks. This clashes with a long time booked holiday but the breeder is more than happy to hang onto our puppy (they are very laid back with stuff like this). Rather than rushing over to get him immediately, I was thinking of actually working as many hours as I can the following Monday, Tuesday and Wednesday and picking up the Thursday (breeder is home all day Thursday). 

Much as I want to get the puppy asap, there are two reasons for this decision. Working extra hours means I can then not go back to work until the back end of the following week, meaning I have a full week at home with him and can build up to leaving him for a couple of hours and he can settle well. But, this means he's 9 weeks then, does that affect socialisation with us? It didn't seem to affect our friends dog Purdey (our friends Vizsla, puppy's older sister), who was the last of Meg's last litter to go and didn't go home until 11 weeks?

Second, I wanted to bring him home in the day to get him used to crate and surroundings etc, give him time with hubby and myself before the kids come home from school and him to be really tired at bedtime. Is that a good idea too?

I have other questions too but I shall wait! 

Thank you always


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## Ozkar

flynnandlunasmom said:


> I'm a big fan of the name Enzo after reading "The Art of Racing in the Rain".
> 
> If our (human) baby is a boy, his middle name will be Enzo and that's what we'll call him.
> 
> Congrats on the pup! Great pictures.


Great read isn't it........  

If you enjoy motor sports and dogs, it's heaven on a stick!!!


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## Ozkar

Maybe do a search of Hungarian boys names and what they mean, in order to find the right match.

I didn't have a choice with Astro, but Zsa Zsa and Ozkar were picked out by me. Ozkar is a Hungarian name, as is Zsa Zsa I think???? 

Just remember that whatever you call him it will be with him forever. So make sure it's something which won't sound silly on an adult dog.


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## mswhipple

Hey, doublemocha -- Very cute puppies!!

Actually, staying with Mom and the littermates a little extra time offers a nice benefit. He will be learning lessons about being a dog, and among them is bite inhibition. This will help YOU when teaching him not to bite so hard! Remember, though, all puppies are going to nip and bite, and that is perfectly normal.

He will bond with you just as well. I got my dog Willie when he was about one or two (nobody knows for sure), and I have never had a stronger human-to-dog and dog-to human bond. Really! The age doesn't matter, as long as there is love.  

Good luck on the important decision of choosing a name.


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## pippylongstocking

Sounds like a good idea, to spend as much time with your new puppy before going back to work. Mswhipple is right that the extra time spent with litter mates and mum will be beneficial. We picked Ester up just before 8 weeks, but that was 2 give me longer with her before I went back to my part time job after annual leave. I would have felt awful getting her and going to work the next day. Think it selfishly was more for my benefit than hers though! You do what's right for your family, but I would do exactly the same, anything for more cuddles and play! Good luck with the naming!


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## doublemocha

Thank you *Pippy * and* mswhipple * for your advice, it's good to know my thoughts were along the right lines.

Today Cracker is a favourite name in our house, Monday it will be something different  Agree *Ozkar* - it needs to suit the dog ALL it's life 

We had a BBQ yesterday in our back garden, about 15 people in total, 9 kids. Our friends were there with their Vizsla. I SWEAR she was grinning with all the attention, at one stage she was laid flat on her back, legs in the air with 7 kids giving her a belly rub!!! We have a very large garden by UK standards surrounded by woodland (many trees inside the garden too), perfect for a Vizsla, she was in her element. We need to puppy proof the bottom though, there's a couple of areas of escape.

My next question is about bringing the puppy home. I did mention there was loads of questions  I am ok with the journey home, I have a plan for that but what do I do immediately on getting home? I plan on taking him immediately to his pee spot but had then thought to put him in a playpen with me and the crate inside, treats, couple of toys, blanket from Mum etc, rather than let him wander the house. Although I want to shower him with cuddles etc, will I be better trying to be calm and normal rather than overwhelm?

He will have to deal with meeting my kids later in the day and (very likely) the kids they play with and probably our friends dogs the next day (they are FULLY vaccinated and socialised etc) 

Thanks as always


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## hotmischief

Sounds like great planning. Don't make the same mistake as I did with the crate. Encourage him to go in with treats and feed him in the crate. I just picked my pup up and put him in (not having had a crate before) and it rather traumatised him.

Lots of socialising with vaccinated dogs and children is great for him. We have lots of trees and shrubs in our garden and beleive me they are like toddlers everything goes in their mouths - so be careful and keep an eye on him. There are lots of plants and shrubs that are poisonous in the garden. We had never had a problem with our Gt Dane pups but everything goes in Boris's mouth. "Leave" is a very good command to teach early on.

Bye the way I love your excitement, I enjoy sharing in it, but I want another puppy!! Help!!!


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## VictoriaW

Read Ian Dunbar, Before & After You Get Your Puppy.

His crate training schedule, where you put pup in crate for an hour, let it out to pee, play/train in house, then return to crate for the next cycle (with a great chew or stuffed kong) works great in homes with small kids because it creates structure and limits and prevents kids from crowding and overwhelming the puppy. 

We used to hang out on the floor near the crate, reading or playing board games...it really helped her settle down.

Good luck!


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## doublemocha

Get another puppy then Hotmischief, that's the solution  Glad I am not boring you though, you regulars must have had so many of these posts! Thanks for the advice re crate.

Victoria - I do have Ian Dunbar's book. It's an interesting read. I think I have said before, he seems a touch dramatic in parts (one toilet training accident equals FAILURE etc) but I do like his advice. I think I need to read this part again though, I have read a number of books (Gwen Bailey which I loved, Cesar Milan etc), they are blending into one! My kids are 11 and 12, so hopefully old enough to understand.

My question of the day 

Treats and toys! What training treats do Vizsla's particularly like? How do I ensure they are healthy and appropriate? Do I reduce the puppy's normal food to compensate? Ian Dunbar seems to suggest using all the puppy's daily diet for training purposes but I am not sure about that, I think I would prefer to feed at set times. 

Similarly, what toys work best? I have read about Kong's but had thought to save them for time when I have to go out, a special treat etc. Our friends put soft cheese etc in theirs? Do I have training toys and comfort toys? I am aware Vizla's love to fetch and need to chew a lot as puppies.

Sorry, the info out there about treats and toys is a bit limited, unless I have looked in the wrong place 

Our breeder sent some more pictures yesterday, puppies are looking alarmingly like little aliens at the moment


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## hotmischief

Gwen Bailey's book and Caesar Milan's are excellent, but common sense is also good 

Treats, I think this all depends on how greedy your puppy is. Mine was like a vacuum cleaner, so to start with I used his regular kibble for treats. Once we started obedience classes they suggested cheese, hot dogs as a bigger incentive. I think my puppy may be allergic to dairy so I stay away from cheese. I find hot dogs work a treat (excuse the pun). I buy a pack of 10 chop them up into little pieces and then they are always available. I don't use puppy treats from the shop as like a lot of Vizslas mine is grain intorant and I can't be bothered to look for a grain free treat!!! 

Toys. Kongs are great as you can put some peanut butter or marmite inside the konk and give it to him when you put him in his crate at night. You can even put some kibble in it. I now feed raw so sometimes I fill the middle with ground up raw and freeze it and that keeps him busy for ages as he just licks away at the frozen meet. I made the mistake of buying mainly hard toys which he didn't particularly like. It wasn't till I read Gwen Bailey's book and she says to stop them nipping replace your hand or leg with a soft toy. That worked great with Boris. His favorite is a peasant duck with a squeak in it. We have 3 around the house at the moment but he often plays with them. The tough knotted robes are good, but Boris prefers softer toys than that. One thing they all seem to love is Bully sticks. They are dried Bull's Penis. I know ugh!!! Now just to save you from going and getting the smelly ones you can get non smelly ones on ebay and these are very good value; Here is the link:

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Bulls-Piz...3?pt=UK_Pet_Supplies_Dogs&hash=item4161bc6bfb

I bought a toy (the rope note) the week I went to look and choose my puppy and left it so that it had the smell of the litter on. 

I am sure you will get lots of suggestions coming your way, just thought I would add a few of the things I found useful with my pup.


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## adrino

Loads of great advice and suggestions. 

All I can give is my experience. With Elza I quite often used her daily food as treats too. Like that I knew how much she's eating. I often put half of her breakfast and/or last meal into a kong so she would have to work for it. She wouldn't just get it without doing anything for it. Also took it with me for walks and used it while training her. Of course we had some other treats but we limited the amount of those. 
Agree on the soft toys, have plenty of those. We never wanted the squeaky ones but there isn't many without it and it turned out to be good anyway. Also suggest for you the Flexibone and flexiring too, these are softer chew plastic bones and if swallowed they come straight out without issue and they don't hurt the puppy teeth and gums. 

Oh and the most important, don't bother to get expensive bedding for your pup. They end up chewing it, scratching it, shake it and tear it to bits. Get many towels, cheap fleece blankets which you can was regularly. 

Get some good sleep too while you can!


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## doublemocha

Love the name Boris 

Hotmischief - hotdogs as in simply the tinned variety that my kids crave but rarely get?  Just wanting to check. I like that idea, very easily available. The bully sticks look, er, delicious . Do you give in addition to the puppy's usual diet? Are they a special treat or something you can give daily? Sorry, it's all new to me.

I had read about the cuddly toys in Gwen Bailey's book and was planning on buying a few, it's a shame, my daughter has a pile of the things that she could 'donate' but they are probably not suitable.

Adrino - I hadn't heard of flexibone and flexiring, thanks. That's a great tip about bedding, we have pile of old towels that I can use, although possibly no blankets. The Kong's seem like a superb invention.

I really do appreciate all the tips and advice, it might be old hat and very basic information but I SO want to get it right so thank you for all the time you guys take to reply


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## hotmischief

This is the third time I have typed this post and then it disappears, so third time lucky!!

Hotdogs are actually Frankfurters, packets of 5 - 10 from the chiller cabinets in the supermarkets. I am sure your kids will love them too. I have never tried the ones in the cans - they might do.

You can give bully sticks daily if you want. I give them when I need to occupy him or am going out. They are a natural treat and quite safe. I personally give treats in addition to their regular meals as he is not a fat dog. I measure his meals so I know what he is getting on a daily basis, but some days I don't do any training with him other than play retrieve other days I will work him for 10 -15 minutes and he will get maybe 1/2 a frankfurter. He soon runs off any extra calories so I don't count them. 

I think you will have to wait and see how good an eater your puppy is when you get it home. My pup is very food motivated so would be happy to search or work for his food as Adriano suggested. However, I would not use this method on a dog that was a fussy eater.

Yes you could probably use some of your daughters soft toys for a while. Just make sure there are not bits that he could bit off and swallow - but then I am sure you know that from having young children. 

I always use a cardboard box for puppys with something soft inside. With Boris I put the box inside the crate just to make it cosy. I bought Boris a Tuffies bed which he has in the lounge which is his place to go. He gets used to this and we can watch that he doesn't chew it. We have just moved him into it at night now instead of a crate as at 8 months he is over the chewing - hope that isn't famous last words!!!!


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## pippylongstocking

Agree with adrino. Make sure you get plenty of sleep! When we brought Ester home, the first thing we did was put her on the garden to pee. Best to have a quiet day to start with. Just imagine how overwhelming it must be for a puppy to be taken from it's mum and litter mates :'(. Having said that, be sure to get out everywhere with your new addition, to get them used to things. Going to vets We had her crate in the lounge, so she could see and hear us. We made it into a cosy den by covering it up, and gave her treats for going in. I would also recommend kongs, u can give part of his meal allowance in them, and it keeps them busy. You can also hid treats around the house and encourage puppy to go find them! They are also good frozen. Ester's treat for training day is boiled chicken with cheese hotdog and kibble. You can spend an infinite amount of money on toys (we have), but at the end of the day we have found things like knotted t-shirts,(Ester loves to carry her 'Raggy' around), old tea towels etc, make excellent tug toys, and rolled up pieces of carpet for retrieving. We also took a teddy with us when we went to pick her up, and she still loves to sleep with it. Not so good on advice, but happy to share experiences, good or bad! Wow, out of the crate at 8 months. Ester's 7 months and don't think we're quite at that stage yet. Can't imagine what we would get up to find, + we have a 15 year old westie that quite enjoys a peaceful nights sleep! Sorry, I do rattle on, I can talk for England (so I'm told)! ;D


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## adrino

Here's a good link about the nylabone/flexibone. (haven't used this website but you can find all the different kind of nylabones and rings on it)

http://www.snackandtack.co.uk/pets-c5/dog-c6/toys-c7/tasty-bone-flexi-bone-p3389

Some are quite hard, those are for hard chewers but the flexibone is softer and Elza loved/loves it. I still get it for her occasionally as a treat, she destroys it very quickly now but plays forever with the little bits she chews off. 

I have to brag a bit but Elza has been out of her crate ever since we got her... : We have a corridor where we keep her when we are not home. She used to have a crate but we kept it open, only closed her in there when I was cleaning the house. Now (10 months old) she has a basket for about 2-3 months and she's absolutely fine. I am starting to leave her in the living room for a couple of hours while I leave for work and my partner gets up from his nightshift. Only did it once and the little lady slept on his spot on the sofa. Not meant to! But it's ok... 

I guess you have to decide on the rules up front. So everybody sticks to it in the family. One day like this another day like that is no good for your pup. Have a routine and everything will be fine.


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## harrigab

hotmischief said:


> _*This is the third time I have typed this post and then it disappears, so third time lucky!!*_
> 
> Hotdogs are actually Frankfurters, packets of 5 - 10 from the chiller cabinets in the supermarkets. I am sure your kids will love them too. I have never tried the ones in the cans - they might do.
> 
> You can give bully sticks daily if you want. I give them when I need to occupy him or am going out. They are a natural treat and quite safe. I personally give treats in addition to their regular meals as he is not a fat dog. I measure his meals so I know what he is getting on a daily basis, but some days I don't do any training with him other than play retrieve other days I will work him for 10 -15 minutes and he will get maybe 1/2 a frankfurter. He soon runs off any extra calories so I don't count them.
> 
> I think you will have to wait and see how good an eater your puppy is when you get it home. My pup is very food motivated so would be happy to search or work for his food as Adriano suggested. However, I would not use this method on a dog that was a fussy eater.
> 
> Yes you could probably use some of your daughters soft toys for a while. Just make sure there are not bits that he could bit off and swallow - but then I am sure you know that from having young children.
> 
> I always use a cardboard box for puppys with something soft inside. With Boris I put the box inside the crate just to make it cosy. I bought Boris a Tuffies bed which he has in the lounge which is his place to go. He gets used to this and we can watch that he doesn't chew it. We have just moved him into it at night now instead of a crate as at 8 months he is over the chewing - hope that isn't famous last words!!!!


no idea what's happened there H, nothing to do with me.


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## doublemocha

FANTASTIC!!

Thank you, such useful information.

Adrino - we have spoken to the children about consistency and boundaries for the puppy and that we all need to be 'signing from the same hymn sheet', so to speak. I think it helps that the kids are 12 (13 on Friday!) and 11 and able to fully understand this concept. Thanks for the link, I will purchase a couple of flexibones. You obviously put a lot of time and effort into Elza, is she your first Vizsla?

Pippy - this is the reason that I want to bring him home during the day if possible, even if it means waiting a couple of extra days. So he can have a few hours with me and hubby, then meet the kids. The next day, I plan on getting our friends to bring their Vizzy and crossbreed over (who is a little angel). We also have a family at the end of the street with lovely dogs and whose mother is a dog trainer, we will pop in there too in the first few days. Actually, I have a list of excellent dogs that he can meet even prior to vaccination to give him lots of good experiences. 

I am not so worried about socialisation with people, our house is like Picadilly Circus on a busy day most times, but I had planned on him meeting the postie (we have the same two, both are lovely) etc.

I had also planned on carrying him to the top of our small road, which meets the main road (if you can it that, we are rural!), to experience traffic etc and also to our friends farm (my daughter rides ponies, all of whom are good natured and used to the 5 farm dogs of various shapes and sizes, all well trained) The farm will be after vaccination though. Also, my son plays Rugby so that's a great way to meet tons of new folk, again after vaccination.

I had heard about freezing the Kong to extend the experience/fun!

Hotmischief - yes, I will learn as I go with our own Vizsla, I am not sure I have met one who isn't food motivated though


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## doublemocha

Question of the day!! 

Do I start training immediately or let him settle in for a few days?

Obviously I will start toilet training immediately but do you start other aspects too? 

My expectations are realistic, I have had two kids!! I know it takes repetition, patience, consistency, regression sometimes, and an even temper etc. I don't expect miracles, I just wondered when you start the basic commands and lead training etc?


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## Ozkar

Yes...start as soon as possible.


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## lilyloo

doublemocha said:


> Question of the day!!
> 
> Do I start training immediately or let him settle in for a few days?


I think we gave Ruby a break for a day or two, she was tired from the ride home from the breeders and being in a new place, etc. 
After a couple days I decided I wanted to teach her "sit" and expected it to take a while. Literally took 30 seconds and she had it mastered. These pups will amaze you with how smart they are! At 12 weeks she already knew sit, come, stay, down, leave it, off. Each command only took a few minutes for her to learn.


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## adrino

> You obviously put a lot of time and effort into Elza, is she your first Vizsla?


*Doublemocha* I think we all have done it but surely me and my partner turned our life sort of upside down so we can have a vizsla. We work opposite shifts now and the days when we work the same hours she's at her 'dogsitter' all day. 
She is my first vizsla but I did have an English Pointer before so I sort of new what to expect. Still it was a lot of work but I love her to bits. Already thinking of getting another one when she's at least two years old! 

About the training, you can start straight away. Give her a day then do it in short 5-10 minutes sessions. They can't concentrate longer than that at the beginning or they get bored. 
With Elza it was the best to do it after she had some exercise. First she was allowed to do her rooroos and zoomies then we would do the training. She concentrated better when she had a bit of run. Actually I still do the same at 10 months old.


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## doublemocha

Thanks for the information re training. I seem to have settled on Gwen Bailey's book as my first choice read but this forum is 100 times more useful!

Ok, I wandered into our local pet store today. It's quite a large one. I was a bit overwhelmed wandering up and down the aisles looking at 20 different varieties of puppy food, 100's of leads, 1000's of toys, flea treatments, crates, grooming aids. I bought a non slip stainless steel bowl, a couple of soft toys, another toy and a puppy Kong (which looked pretty much the same size as a medium Kong) Also, some poop bags 

I did look at a number of puppy collars and leads (all plain black, I am a minimalist )) but I might need some help from you guys? The basic nylon collar and lead was very soft, is this best? What size do I go for?

Our breeder phoned today to give an update, she's calling me back as her mobile rang but all the puppies are thriving, they have had some tails docked and 8 out of 12 are already sold, with another couple coming tonight. I am so pleased and appreciative of the effort they are going to to keep up informed, it's not like they don't have a busy life at the moment. Lots of piccies, updates etc, we can visit as much as we like. It's so nice, I feel really involved


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## doublemocha

Just spoken to the breeder again, all puppies sold, she has people visiting this week too that will likely fill the remaining puppy vacancies.

All puppies happy and healthy, two are slightly larger than the rest but only slightly. Poor Meg (the Mum) has had to cope with a variety of strange people in the house for the last week but has been fantastic and cuddled everyone without fuss


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## hotmischief

You have puppy-itise   I wasn't quite as bad as you, I am pleased to say. I used a couple of old flat bottomed tupperware bowls for feed bowls when he came home. I was really pleased I hadn't bought a bowl as he inhaled his food like I have never seen before. I ended up buying one those bowls with lumps in it to slow him down. Quite a few of us have had to use these bowls.

Just get a little light weight adjustable collar to begin with as you will need to let it out every couple of weeks as they grow so fast. A light weight lead not too long so you don't get tangle up.

The breeder should send him home with a bag of feed that will probably do you for a week. Don't be tempted to change feeds for a while. The puppy's immune system has a lot of changes to cope with - within its new home and garden, then you have it vaccinated and again the immune system has to cope with this. Lots of puppies get upset tummies when they get to their new homes - so keep the changes to the minimum for a while.

How many weeks until count down?


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## doublemocha

HotMischief - The puppies are ready on 31st October, however we are on holiday then, so will pick him up a few days after this. I want to do this during the day, so will work around our breeders working hours and mine.

Are there any specific dry foods that any of you guys would recommend? I am happy to pay more for a good quality food. I know I need to change the food gradually from the puppy's usual food. I know our breeder will have a view too, they mentioned the protein content when I visited but said they would cover in more depth later.

I am then going to search for the dried liver treat recipe I have seen mentioned


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## doublemocha

Ok, scrap the last question, I did a search on this site and have it covered


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## tanners_mama

doublemocha said:


> Are there any specific dry foods that any of you guys would recommend? I am happy to pay more for a good quality food. I know I need to change the food gradually from the puppy's usual food. I know our breeder will have a view too, they mentioned the protein content when I visited but said they would cover in more depth later.
> 
> I am then going to search for the dried liver treat recipe I have seen mentioned


Hi Doublemocha - and congrats on your soon-to-be new V  I'm sure if you do a seach on this site for food, you will find alot of threads tied to what we like to feed our Vizslas. That being said, a few that worked with Tanner really well when he was a puppy, was the Wellness Puppy food, and eventually switching over to Acana, grain free. That worked best for us, but it might not work for you. Try things out, buy small bags, see what sticks. 

I also wanted to mention you may want to hold off on the treats for a bit. When Tanner was a puppy I simply used his kibble as treats, so it did not upset his stomach too much. There were a few instances I would give him treats and I would regret it later on. Just something to think about.

Other than that - good luck and HAVE FUN!


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## hotmischief

I went through several kibbles when changing his diet - very loose stool when on the kibble the breeder had sent him home on. Acana (grain free) worked well for Boris. I now read a mixture of RAW and Acana kibble and apart from a minor allergy he is doing great!!

I also used the kibble for training treats to begin with as they were small and dry to go in my pockets. I use the frankfurters now - just found some gluten free frankfuters in Tesco this week!!


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## roxy2011

hi doublemocha

ok when i collected roxy the breeder gave me a tub of food...its was eukanuba not cheap ( buy on web cheaper 40 pounds a sack) as she was already on solid food as 8 1/2 weeks when i collected her. i stuck with that food until she was 6 months as she grew amazingly on it. i changed her to hills science plan and now she is on CJS (13 pounds per sack) 

toys...a good teddy that all your family have handled before the v arrives is amazing and will get him/her used to yours and your childrens smells. 

treats: puppy treats were easy...i stuck to smelly ones for training as they are sooo food orientated..misfits are good...but now just plain hot dog sausage (the smell is great for agility) 

general name advice...pick a couple and choose on sight...roxy was gonna be cosmo (my favorite cocktail) but she was sooo chilled out on the 2 hour drive home that she was roxy surfer girl straight away ;D

good luck....roxy stayed away for 2 nights this week due to my shift pattern and frankly my life was odd without her about :-*


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## doublemocha

Thank you 

I have spent more than an hour doing various searches on this site for puppy food - there's so much difference of opinion it's hard to find one particular brand that stands out. Trial and error seems to come over. Acana come out well though, as does Eukanuba, I need to google CJS though, not sure it's so readily available? But I am glad to have some specific tips to be honest, at least as a starter.

Roxy - thanks for the tips, I actually like Cosmo for a boy, another fun name. Oscar is popular at the moment in the household!

Tesco sells EVERYTHING Hotmischief, I find!!!

Tannas_Mamma - thanks re the treats. Poor thing will have so much to contend with in the first few days, new home, new smells, new routine, injections, no Mummy


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## doublemocha

Also, Orijen (spelling?), made by the makers of Acana seems to get excellent reviews.

Please may I ask what is the appropriate protein requirement per day for a puppy?

I wont ask if he requires specific puppy food, that seems to creat wild debate


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## LaVidaLoca

Hey *doublemocha*

after we nearly finished the food which our breeder recommended for the fist few weeks we started to feed Orijen to our puppy but the result was loose stool all the time. Orijen is quite high in protein ( over 30% ). 

We switched to Taste of the Wild puppy which has 27% protein and 15% fat. We never had loose stool again and she loves the smoked salmon taste. Our puppy is now 8 months and we will soon switch to ToW adult food which has a protein amount of only 25%.

If you'll feed a kibble with a high protein amount - your pup will be more active or some would even say more 'hyper'.
What I've found out in my researchs ( A Vizsla makes you a good researcher ;D ) is that kibble with a protein of 25% and fat of 15% is optimal. 
I would recommend to go definitely for grain free kibble. I would always prefer Ancana or Tase of the Wild ( my pup didn't like the Ancana puppy food )

Another point is the calcium / phosphorus ratio. In an adult dog optimal is 80/60 mg, giving an average of 1.33. Puppies have a higher need, the mean here is optimally at 1.9 to 2.0.

An excess of calcium can lead to skeletal problems, too high protein content makes the dogs very quickly build muscle mass, which can lead to joint and skeletal problems because bones and joints grow more slowly than muscles.

Many V owners feed directly adult food. 

Happy Researchs ! ;D


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## hotmischief

Re the feed - you might choose a brand of food and then find that it doesn't suit your puppy. I tried several really good brands that didn't suit Boris for various reasons.

I really liked the look of Orijen but he had liquid poos on it - and that was just introducing it. I spoke to the nutrionalist at Orijen/Acana and she recommended Acana as it is not so high in protein. She also advised that you do not need to feed puppy kibble - Acana is for all ages!!

NB Whatever you get only get small bags first as reading on the forum we have all tried several different brands before settling on something that they like and do well on.

Food is a huge mine field in which you can spend lots of money


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## doublemocha

Thanks* LaVidaLoca*. The breeder did mention that higher protein levels can result in higher energy levels but that her husband was the expert and would speak to me about it. Having looked further at the reviews for Orijen, the high protein level and loose stool scenario does come over as an issue.

I appreciate the information re appropriate protein content and calcium/phosphorus too.

Looking at price, it's pretty easy to work out the price per kilo of Taste of the Wild, the varieties are the same price. Acana is slightly harder but generally, they look comparable in price.

Can I give the puppy (after I switch over gradually) different 'flavours' of the same brand or do I stick to the same one? I will absolutely go grain free, whichever kibble works best.

Yes, food is a huge minefield, especially to a novice but I do want to do the right thing, so will spend the appropriate time researching etc. Why did you switch to the raw diet *HotMischief*?


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## hotmischief

I am a great believer in RAW diet - but I have to say that I couldn't be bothered to buy all the different meats from a butcher or the supermarket. I buy a balance already prepared raw food from a company called Natural Instinct. It has fruit and vegetable mixed in and they only use human grade meats. There are three or four forum members in the UK that buy from them. It comes in 1Kg tubs frozen, so I keep a months supply in the deep freeze.

The reason why I feed predominantly raw is because my Gt Dane had cancer two years ago and when we saw the specialists at the Animal Health Trust in Newmarket one of the issues that they raised was that there is a probable link between kibble and cancer. Also over vaccinating.

My puppy lost a lot of weight in the first couple of weeks that we had him with tummy upsets caused by food that contained grain, then the Orijen that wasn't suitable. The Acana was good and I still feed it, but the nutrionalist in the shop where I get the Acana recommended this raw food - I tried it, he loves it and looks great on. When he reaches a year I will cut out the kibble altogether and he will have just raw.

Here is the link for the company - they do next day deliver all over the UK.

http://www.naturalinstinct.com/


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## doublemocha

That site looks amazing HotMischief, does it work out more expensive than kibble? Is it hard to figure out how much to give? I can't quite figure it out! Can you give different varieties?

In any event, I will start with dried food.

Today we like Zeb (Zebedee), that one might stick actually!

A question again  When the puppy is little, would it be better to get up through the night and take him out for a toilet break, to encourage good toilet habits or am I best creating a toilet area in the playpen/contained area (away from the crate) to encourage the puppy to accept being 'alone' at night? The books differ and I wondered what peoples views were?

If it helps, after 4 weeks (or 5, I can't remember) the puppies and Meg their Mum move to a specially created wooden 'house' just outside the breeders door, in the yard. The 'house' (it's a bit like a kids play house) has heat lamps, a webcam so they can be supervised at all times and it's own little back yard so the puppies can explore in safety. The fence around it is high enough to contain them but Meg can jump over it if she needs a break. The breeder then continues to take the puppies into the house, but 3/4 at a time, rather than 12, which she says is a bit much even for her!!!

The benefit to this is that the puppies learn to go in the 'back yard' of the 'house', so perhaps I am better taking the puppy outside even in the middle of the night? I just wondered if it would be too cold or wet for him in the middle of November (doesn't bother me, I run in all weathers!) or wake him up too much to settle him down again without fuss?

Thanks 

I know not to make a fuss at all during the night, no contact, quiet etc, this worked a treat when my kids were little


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## hotmischief

I don't think the natural instinct costs any more to feed than a good quality kibble and there are lots of different flavours so he gets a change of flavor every two days, although he is greedy enough not to worry if he eats the same thing every day. Start with the dry and as you seem to have a very helpful breeder I would go with what she recommends for a few months until you get her settled.

Potty training!! That is another mine field!!!You will get lots of suggestions on that topic. Again I think it comes down to what suits you. My puppy was very up set and wouldn't pee or poo in the toilet area of the huge crate we had. The only way we could settle him at night was to leave the crate door open and he had pads by the back door for night time use. Over five weeks he peed less and less and then when his bladder was large enough to go through the night. Personally that worked for us as we all got some sleep, he was very clean only peed on the pads.

Others with tell you that by getting up in the night you will train them more quickly and I wouldn't disagree with that - however I haven't got the stamina to get up and take him out in the middle of the night.


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## pippylongstocking

We (I) got up in the night with Ester. She was very good and would not soil her crate, but it did mean a lot of lost sleep for me! Loving all the names you are coming up with, you sound like us, we regularly come up with names for dogs, even though we have no new puppy  Love Zeb! we also like Angus ( not as much as Moose), Seb, Albert, Rupert, Red. The list is endless. You will find one that suits your little chap, but if you are like us, we come up with several different nicknames for our dogs. Ester is regularly called Ness! As for food, we switched from eukanuba puppy, to pro plan, but her stools were mostly loose, and I wanted to go grain free, so she is now on TOTW which she seems to like, especially with a little chicken, tuna or cheese on!


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## doublemocha

Thank you HotMischief (again, you are so kind) and Pippy, although you disagree!! I suspect that if, on the first night, it is lashing down with rain, blowing a gale and -3 outside, we will go with puppy pads!!

We did think of Seb and liked that name, LOVE Albert. Both my kids and all their friends get nicknames from me, this WILL happen with the puppy.

Hopefully, I will get to post some more pictures next week as we are going to see the puppies again (maybe choose one, but maybe wait)  8 have had their tails docked, given so many buyers wanted to work their dogs (most of the puppies have been sold via word of mouth), so likely we will end up with a docked puppy but I really don't mind actually either way, as long as he suit us. My research on the net didn't lead me to a particular view either way.

I am reading another thread with interest at the moment about whether puppies can be deemed as dominant. If they can't, then how does the breeder select the right puppy for you?


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## doublemocha

Just mildly concerned I will get a dominant puppy, despite the best efforts of all concerned!!


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## redrover

As far as changing the flavor of the food goes, it's going to depend on your puppy. I know a lot of dogs that go back and forth between all the flavors of the same brand/make of their food. Jasper, however, cannot.

He gets fed Acana Pacifica, and thrives on it. One day the local store was out of it and we only had enough of the Pacifica to make it a few more days. So I picked up a bag of something else (I think it was Grasslands) and mixed it in with the Pacifica. No dice. Diarrhea, upset tummy, the whole works, even when what he was being fed was mostly his normal kibble. So for whatever reason, switching around flavors did not go well for us, but I know other folks that manage it just fine. So you might have to try it and see how it goes. 

If you've spoken to your breeder about your temperament desires in a pup, as well as any planned activities (do you want a hunter, an agility dog, a therapy dog, or just a companion?), and they've really spent a lot of time with the pups and possibly done some behavioral testing, then they can give you a good indication of which pup might best meet those desires. Obviously no one can predict exactly how a dog will grow up, but experienced breeders do their best.

If you haven't previously spoken to your breeder about this, do so now, or on the day you go to pick him up. And even if your breeder does pick a less headstrong puppy for you, it could turn out to rule the roost if you let him get away with things! I find that just being consistent in training and how the rules work can usually curb any undesirable tendencies, unless you have a very willful puppy. At the "teenager" stage, of course, this becomes a little more difficult! Note that I'm not a huge proponent of dominance theory, particularly in regards to how dogs interact with humans. There are lots of blog posts and articles about this kind of thing--if you read up on them, you'll think that they're really splitting hairs with their definitions, and it does get a little fuzzy. It all comes down to your personal point of view and your training methods--there's plenty of disparity on this point in the forum! That's the great thing about this place--plenty of room for multiple opinions.


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## doublemocha

Redrover - thanks. Yes, we have spoken at length to the breeder about our requirements for a puppy. They are aware that we are inexperienced and would prefer to have a puppy whose temperament suits that situation. As a family, we have agreed that, in reality, it will be myself who is responsible (in the main) for training him (given I am at home most of the time) but that we all need to be consistent and enforce the same set of rules/requirements. Kids are 13 and 11, so old enough to understand.

We also have a 'good example' Vizsla in our friends dog. At 18 months, she is amazingly well behaved/trained but my friends have put in hours of time to ensure this is the case.

My first big lesson was initially visiting a breeder who had an amazing website, interviewed me at length, made me fill out lots of paperwork etc, members of the relevant breeding schemes etc. All seemed super. When we visited, the bitch who they planned a litter from snapped at both myself and my husband and their other dogs barked incessantly in the shed the whole time we were there. 

The breeder we have now chosen doesn't do the 'fancy' approach at all but have small kids, use their dogs for falconry, have land that they use and clearly know exactly what they are doing. Most of their litters are sold via word of mouth. All their dogs (3 adults including Meg who had given birth only 24 hours previously) were super. Our friends dog is our puppy's sister. The 'feel' was so different. Our breeder has said the whole litter is so calm! Hopefully we have good foundations to put our inexperience into!


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## doublemocha

Question of the day! 

Today during my lunch I was researching worming the puppy. The advice that I can find suggests worming them every month until they are 6 months old, then every 3 months after that.

My only concern was that most of the sites with this advice were clearly sponsored, with a suggestion for a particular brand or worming treatment! So, would you guys condone this advice or have an alternative? Would this regime be subjecting the dog to unnecessary chemicals?

I did a search on this site but it didn't come up with too much so here I am again, asking questions!

Hopefully, if some one in the future searches on the site, this one thread will provide ALL the information they require.


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## jld640

Re worming your puppy - I would go with your vet's recommendation. He/she will know the local conditions of exposure.


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## hotmischief

Your breeder should tell you when the puppy was last wormed and should give you a puppy pack with details of when to worm them again.

I think here in the UK they recommend every 2 weeks until 3months and then at 6 months. I use Dronotal on both my dogs.

As jld640 suggests talk to your vet before you take the puppy in for vaccinations. I think you shouldn't vaccinate too close to worming, so it would be good to check with your vet.


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## redrover

I don't remember the vet having me worm Jasper all that much. He was wormed at the breeder's, and I remember doing it maybe twice with the little syringe the vet gave me, at say...12 and 16 weeks? Maybe just 12 weeks, really. After that, either they did it when I wasn't looking during his vaccinations, or they didn't do it again.

I did have to bring them stool samples at each vaccination, so I assume if they saw worms then, they'd have given him another dose. 

Most heartworm preventatives contain a dewormer like pyrantel, and so are effective against other parasitic worms. The vet had me start him on those as soon as it got warm enough, which was when he was about 4 months or so. So it's basically a monthly worming, but it's as part of his regular heartworm preventative.


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## Ozkar

Not sure if the Aussie worms are more virulent, but we worm ours every month and have done since we got them. All my dogs over the years have been given a monthly worming tablet.


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## hotmischief

I think in hot climates you have more of an issue with worms than we have in the UK. We don't have heartworm in the UK, but I understand how deadly they can be.

In the UK the main worms we worm agains are round worm, pin worm and tape worm.

I have often wondered why vets recommend we worm so frequently, besides the fact that they hope you buy them from them. ( Much cheaper on line. Also Cosco started selling frontline this year = 30% cheaper than on line.) I guess puppies are always picking things up and putting them in their mouths and therefore there is a bigger risk of worms.

I only do adult dogs 2x a year.


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## 5crazydogs!

Hi DBLmocha 

Just an idea but if your not picking up your baby until 9 weeks, maybe you could wear a bandanna around your wrist for a few days and then send (or give) it to the breeder so it can be put with the pup .... the pup has an idea of your scent. 

My puppies are 4 weeks and as soon as we figure out who's going to who ... I will likely do that.

Tiffiney


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## doublemocha

Thank you for your helpful advice on worming. Having read the forums in depth, my main concern with taking the (any) vets advice was that many of them seem to be 'affiliated' to a certain brand of food or product, which may not be in the best interests of our Vizsla. Also, the comments about neutering at 6 months (or not) on the recommendation of many vets had made me concerned that their advice would be impartial. I feel more reassured now.

5crazydogs - we have already spoken to the breeder about this, she is going to take a piece of clothing (or something) from us and put it in a sealed bag, to give the puppy a few days before we pick him up. I will also give her something to take away with her mother's smell on too. I had planned on putting both in his crate. We plan on visiting regularly too (probably more for our benefit than the puppy!) Thanks for the advice  How are you finding the experience of your litter so far? I hope that you are not reading anything on here that is setting alarm bells off for you as a breeder!!


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## doublemocha

Also - are they gaining their own little personalities yet? Have you an idea who is going to who? I am still a touch concerned about him being 9 weeks rather than 8! Our breeder has both mum and dad btw (they bought the dog relatively recently as his owners were divorcing) so it's been nice to see Dad, Mum, Grandma and sister are so calm and lovely


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## doublemocha

Question of the day 

I am looking at formal training courses for our puppy and doing some research. It appears that we have a branch of The Gundog Club only a 10 minute drive from where we live, which offers specific training (for all levels of experience from puppyhood onwards) for all breeds of Gundog. There's a lot of information on the site that I haven't read yet, it's very thorough. You don't have to ultimately work your dog but can complete the training (it's a non competive, stage based course) anyway.

Or, would I be better sticking to general 'puppy classes'? From what I read, training our Vizsla to 'work' (in whatever form that takes) will benefit him enormously, and consequently ourselves as a family, given he will be doing what he is genetically programmed to do! I am also quite interested in this.

I plan to do training at home too, lots of it btw. 

Having a few wobbles today that we a 'up to standard' for a Vizsla. This is from reading the posts on here and also the article 'I thought they were good with kids' (quote 'a vizlsa is a very poor first dog'). We have the time, commitment, space and love for a Vizsla but the experience? I am worried today :-[


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## Ozkar

As long as the trainers and program check out OK, then having a Gundog specific training program is always going to be a smarter way to go for your V. 

Normal puppy classes have to cater to all dogs, from lap to working, so the tools and techniques may sometimes conflict with what you want to achieve with your dog. 

The most important thing for me when deciding on which trainer, is that they are aligned with my thinking and share a similar mindset towards animals as I do. If not, then I go elsewhere.


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## hotmischief

doublemocha,

Your doubts are perfectly natural - you are going into the unknown. I had a lot of doubts before I got Boris and he was the 7/8 dog we had had. I can't tell you the number of times I thought about picking up the phone and calling the breeder and telling her I didn't think I should have him.

Some times too much information is a bad thing. I think you have been reading post from members who have had viszla with problems and that in itself has been a problem aound children. Most vizsla are great with children as your friends vizsla is. I think several members expressed concern when someone talks about getting a viszla and they have a baby or very young children - I agree with them these dogs require as much attention as a baby in their formative years and that is a lot for any one to commit to if they have a baby or very young children.

Your children are older and will be able to play and enjoy your puppy. You would be very unlucky to get a puppy that was aggressive, especially as your breeder is going to help you choose a suitable pup for your family. 

Although I had many sleepless night (when I should have been making good on the sleep) before we picked Boris up, I am so pleased we got him - he has bought us immense joy and is a lovely pup who has fitted into our live style. So Cheer up 

While you wait to pick up your pup go along and watch a couple of sessions at your local gundog club, I expect you will find it very interesting. I take Boris to a local obedience class and he has done really well but is now well and truely better than the other dogs in the advance classes. As I feel he needs more stimulation I did like you and searched the webb and have choosen a very active local gunclub that likewise does all sorts of things. They have different sorts of training and I will be guided by them as to what we try. We go for our first session on the 1st Sunday in October - can't wait  The only thing I am disappointed with is that they only meet once a month except for test days, and that really isn't enough when you are socializing a young pup - so if that is the same with your local club I would ALSO find a local obedience class. It won't hurt him to do both for a while.

Keep thinking good thoughts - your wrinkled pup will soon be with you.


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## doublemocha

Thanks Hotmischief I really needed to hear that today. You are so kind to contribute so often, it is much appreciated. You are right, these forums are wonderful and supportive and informative and it is absolutely right that we go into this with our eyes open but I am also scaring myself a little I think too.

I was also talking to my brother last night who has a ten week old puppy (a crossbreed) who is everywhere (furniture, rooms etc), peeing everywhere, nipping, howling the place down etc. They mentioned they hadn't started training him yet too, no crate etc. This isn't how I want to 'parent' our Visla at all (I don't parent my own kids like this!!) but it makes a few doubts creep in that I can ensure consistency, boundaries, good habits etc but be realistic too.

Hadn't thought about visiting the gundog club, that's a good suggestion. I have emailed their accredited trainer, so will wait to hear what she says. Please let me know how you get on when you go for your first session in October with Boris, he sounds like a clever chap so the extra stimulation may be brilliant.

Thanks Ozkar too for your advice


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## doublemocha

So, I spoke with our breeder last night. Puppies and Mum are all doing just great. They are all growing nicely and very content. There is one puppy who is just that bit more adventurous than the others, always at the edge of the whelping box etc. In fact, a few nights ago, the breeder heard crying from downstairs for the first time since having the pups. She went downstairs and this particular pup had managed to get out of the box and was at the other end of the kitchen, confused. She's going to watch this one!!

In fact, yesterday, our breeder spent the entire day (taking advantage of the husband being at home) trying to find 12 tiny collars in 12 different colours!!

We also chatted about puppy feed etc. They are also of the opinion that our puppy should be left 'intact' until 18 months, no running with him until then etc too.

She assured me that she believes very much that (as long as they do their own very responsible job as breeders) what we are prepared to put into our puppy is what we will get out and they MUST know whose 'boss' at all times. Consistency, time, effort etc. I feel more reassured today.

We are going to visit on Saturday evening, so more piccies will follow


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## hotmischief

Goodmorning doublemocha,

I just had to share this information with you. So many of us suffer sleep deprevation for the first week when we bring our puppies home. I am not alone that Boris cried every night for 5 nights - awful for all of us.

Yesterday, I purchased Sporting Gun (instead of Horse & Hound) on my way round Tesco, as you do, right  In the magazine is a section on "got a Question" for a vet.. Someone wrote in and said they were collecting a new puppy what advise could he give him for bring the pup home. This is his abriviated reply.

1) Get a cage
2) *A few days before bring your pup home get an Adaptil diffuser from your vet * ( you can get them on ebay cheaper) plug it in close to the cage - this will make her feel right at home.
3)Give a blanket to the breeder for a few days before collecting puppy.
4) Insist on being given some of the food the puppy has been weened on.
5) Make it part of the deal that you will have the puppy vet checked within 48hrs of picking up the puppy and can immediately return it for a full refund should a significant problem be found. Very important as a few members have had some awful health issues with their puppies.
6) Allow no honeymoon period. Be nice but do not treat him like a baby for 2 weeks and then complain about his behaviour
7) Enjoy your puppy he won't be a puppy for long.
8)I like this one - if he is going to be a working dog don't let your children pick his name!!!!

I know most of the above have already been mentioned but I thought the Adaptil diffuser was a mega idea. Adrino and a friend of mine have had great results with the spray for car sickness. If I were starting over I would definitely get one.

Food for thought!!


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## adrino

Hi doublemocha, I wrote this post yesterday but I forgot to actually post it... Hope it's not too late. 

I'm glad you're in a better mood today. All sound promising!

I haven't taken Elza to any class to be honest. We almost paid for a one to one trainer but now I'm happy we didn't. Only because I keep meeting with the guy and I don't like him anymore. He's keep commenting on Elza all the time. She's too skinny she's like this shes like that and once she saw Elza on the leash (slip lead) and he said its a choke lead!!! If he would know anything about hunting dogs he would know its not. At 10 months Elza is not great on the leash but most of the time she's fine. Only pulls if she sees another dog. I was confident enough to train her myself and my parter keeps it up too. We still do training almost every day. Just 10 minutes here and there so she doesn't get bored. She pushes her boundaries so we gotta do it or she might think she can do whatever she wants. 

If you'll be consistent and keep doing it every day you'll be fine!!!


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## doublemocha

Hi Hotmischief - Did Boris settle after 5 nights? Doesn't seem TOO bad compared to babies!! That's a great post, thank you. I was aware of most of the points (people used to say that about my kids 'enjoy them' - ha, easier said than done on half an hours sleep!!!) All points covered, blanket, food, cage (hopefully donated from friends), he will be insured for 4 weeks from the breeder, name (changes 4 times a day, EVERY day!).

What I didn't know about at all was Adaptil. I have so far just read the Amazon reviews on the product. That's my research tonight then!! Interesting point/advice and completely new to me. Any opinions welcome!

Adrino - Thanks  I too think that I am ok with the basic training. Some good books and this forum. I might use general classes for socialisation purposes, although we know a lot of people with well behaved dogs too. I am interested in further training which is gundog specific though, I know this is a while away yet but it looks so beneficial for our puppy that it's worth investigating I feel. I am surprised by the 'skinny' comment from an 'expert' tbh, I can sort of understand it from somebody not used to dogs but an expert?!


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## adrino

I would definitely use the Adaptil if I were you. I think my breeder suggested it to me but unfortunately I didn't get it for Elza when we got her. I only started to use it when we had issues in the car. And I have to say its the best thing ever! We only used the spray but for home use I suggest the diffuser. If we will have another pup I will definitely get it. 

Elza needed some time to settle but I put this down to my partner being impatient. First night he was back to work I was on my own with Elza. Left her crying for 45 minutes then she settled. Never cried again. 8)

It's hard but its for your and her own sake. Got some earplugs which helped a lot!


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## hotmischief

If I ever get another puppy I will definitely use the Adaptil diffuser - I am so impressed with how it has worked on Elza and my firend's whippet. If it reduces their stress surely it is a kind thing to do!!!

doublemocha - Boris kept us awake for 5 whole nights - couldn't believe that such a little scrap of fur could make so much noise - never stopped. I think a lot of the problem for him was being shut in the crate. He was very stressed by that and also he wouldn't pee or poo in it and although we did try getting up to let him out it didn't really help. I think half the time by going down to let him out (although we never made eye contact or spoke to him - unless he peed outside) we were in fact praising bad behaviour by just going down to see him. In the end we left the crate door open with a child gate up in the kitchen door way and put puppy pads down. From then on we never heard a peep out of him.

Believe me 5 nights was 4 too many. Nearly returned him to the breeder, it was so distressing for him and us. I really would try the adaptil diffuser.


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## doublemocha

Ok! I will try the Adaptil. The reviews are interesting that I have read. The same thing crossed my mind Hotmischief about getting up in the night to let him go pee, given it will be November, I thought it might wake him up to be honest, all the cold freezing air.

Our friends have suggested ear plugs and insisted that we must be tough for everybody's sake too Adrino!

I am sorry but I have MORE questions!!

Firstly, do I go for a travel crate or the sort of bars which fence off the boot (trunk in USA?) of the car from the passenger area? If a crate, should it be a different crate to the indoor one?

Riding with the passengers with a harness will be a complete no go for my husband, both cars are new and expensive to be honest and that would be a bridge too far for him. I understand and respect this, it's one of the few luxuries he enjoys in life, given the hours he works. He's fine with the house maybe getting a touch 'used' but the cars, no!

Second, do I need a playpen and crate? The breeder says if we get a playpen, then consider a roof because Vizsla's can jump high and our puppy will learn this mighty quick!! I had thought to put the crate in the playpen in the kitchen as we have the space there. My alternative is just a crate and using our utility room instead but that's a touch more isolated from the general sociabilty of the kitchen. Any thoughts?

Thank you as always


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## hotmischief

I had never had a crate in the car before as Gt Danes grew too quickly and would not fit one with in a few week.

We managed to borrow two crates one for the car and one for the house. The crate in the car was great. He out grew this by about 4 months and I bought a crate on ebay - here is the link. The one we had in the kitchen was too big to move between car and house - far too much hassle.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Foldable-...UK_Pet_Supplies_Dogs&var=&hash=item35bf73f760

The large on fits in both the estate and the 4x4 with a door on the short side and one on the long side. I figured that if he out grows it I will just re sell it on ebay and won't have lost a lot.

Personally I would just put a crate in your utility room, but I don't know your house plan or where you want to keep your pup out of. We have just moved Boris to a bed as I at 8 months he doesn't chew and I really don't want a crate in my kitchen long term. That is just me and I think you need to see what suits you, but a crate for the car is a good idea.

Re the child gate - yes your breeder is absolutely right. At 8 months we are now having to sort that out as he jumps out to be with the Dane at night and then jumps back in before we come down in the morning. I have tried coming down and putting him back in his bed so he knows it is wrong to jump out, but these are smart dogs  Tonight he is going to have the kitchen door closed on him - I am slightly smarter than him


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## Darcy1311

I have a dog box for the car which is an absolute godsend, I know Darcy is safe in there and the car is always fairly clean....In the house I have a crate, get the biggest one you can get for your money, Darcy is only in it for a few hours 3 or 4 times a week, but when she was going through her chewing stage....and crikey she could chew for England.. and Scotland also.. it was worth it's weight in gold. Now at 18 months of age the chewing has stopped...I think....I still put her in the crate as I don't want her to hurt herself if she was to dive around the house when I was out.....at the end of the day it's all about keeping them safe..


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## doublemocha

Okay dokey - a travel crate it is too!

Yesterday, we went to see our puppy. A tribe of us went as our friends went too with their dog. Our breeders don't mind in the slightest, their house is 'happy chaos', which is what our house is like, always some person calling round, house full etc. I like that.

So, our breeder took the kids to see the puppies (8 kids altogether, including her kids and their friends) while we were all provided with a nice cold beer/wine (kids got milkshakes and biscuits!) and a cuddle with the adult dogs (4 in total) and a long chat with her husband about all the practicalities. My hubby spent ages talking with him about how he works the dogs, so I know he fancies trying this now! Another family (friend of the breeders) dropped by, neither the adult dogs or puppies bother. Such a lovely atmosphere, so different to our first experience, where everything was done 'by the book' but just not in the way these owners love and understand their dogs.

Then, we all got a puppy to cuddle! Meg, their Mum does not bad an eyelid at all, just enjoys cuddling all the strangers herself. The kids passed the puppies back and forward (under supervision) and this didn't seem to bother them at all. Just a few little squeaks, nuzzles and explores then they dozed off again! I had a little man in my arms who just snuzzled in and went to sleep.

By now, hubby (who still had a few reservations/nerves pre trip) was smitten with his puppy, who had squeaked a touch then gone to sleep in his arms. So, now we have our puppy!! Alfie!!
Hubby has taken the camera with him to my sons rugby training this morning, he's in love 

I will post our piccies next, we all had a cuddle.


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## doublemocha

Alfie!!


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## doublemocha

'I don't want a dog, I am not having a dog, never ever'


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## adrino

Haha! Tiny!!! 

My little Elza is there somewhere! ;D
She's wearing the purple collar! 8)


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## doublemocha

Alfie now has his very own, extremely snazzy collar with little silver hearts on it, he also has a docked tail, so we know the difference between the puppy with the same snazzy collar but undocked tail! We didn't mind docked or not tbh.

Cute puppies  Was that the full litter?


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## adrino

Yes, unfortunately 2 puppies were born dead and 4 ladies left and although we wanted a male we were happy to be able to take a girl home. I have to say she's the funniest lovely little lady I could have wished for.


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## pippylongstocking

Ah, so cute. Makes me want another one right now! Loving the name too!  Looking forward to more pics as he grows. I haven't put any pics of Ester on yet, as not sure how to do it. Waiting for the kids to help! I'm only 44 and work on a computer every day! ;D ;D ;D


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## doublemocha

Oh Adrino, that's quite sad  But, good stuff coming from bad in that you got your Elza.

The waiting list for this litter was 7 for girls and 2 for boys. Meg had 10 boys and 2 girls. So, we were one of the first people to get the phone call that we could have a puppy, given that when she telephoned, no girls had arrived at that stage. They did wonder if the 'girl people' would still want a boy but invited those on the list to come and see the pups anyway.

Actually, most changed their minds and only one person decided to find a girl from another litter. So most people who wanted girls now will be getting boys and they sold the rest within the week! It's all good though isn't it? Fate, I reckon 

Pippy - would love to see some piccies if you figure it out  As you guys all said, the name wasn't a particular favourite (we did like it though) until we chose him and then..... we all said 'Alfie' 

Will be puppy shopping next week now it's real!


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## doublemocha

I did do some shopping online yesterday, purchasing a few soft toys that were reduced from their original price (I am a touch nervous about using old cuddlies from my daughter, given they are not dog specific), some Kong tennis balls and a Frisbee and a travel crate!

I did quite a lot of research for the crate and am praying I measured the boot of my car correctly. It an Ferplast Atlas 80, got 5 star reviews wherever I looked (including from a couple of Vizsla owners). I managed to shop around and got it for a really good price. If anyone has any experience for this crate, I would be grateful. The dimensions are 82cm x 51 x 61cm, do you think that's sufficient for a Vizsla, even just through puppyhood? It had better be, as the next size up won't fit! 

Also, in a stroke of good fortune/timing my work are going to get me remote access to our systems, so I can work from home. This alleviates my worries about leaving Alfie initially (although I work only 10ish hours a week, the drive is half an hour and adds to the time I will be out of the house), there is no specific reason why I should be in the office anyway, at least 90% of the time.

I am really pleased about this


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## 5crazydogs!

Ha ha .. Alarm bells . No my husband would say that I am crazy because of Google... I rarely follow my instincts and am constantly saying ... "well on google .. they say ..." I think he may want to cancel the internet by the next litter.

Umm breeding ... Well to be honest we have always had stud dogs and this was our first bitch who we knew we would eventually breed. But typical of our girl she has her own mind and doesn't do things just because we want her too.. So after 5 1/2 years of irregular heats and then IVF and some other fertility issues we finally got our litter of pups. (She also went 3 days past whats considered "normal range" for pregnancy ..but hey whats a week off work waiting for pups to arrive!) 

The puppies just turned 5 weeks and Boy! oh boy are they a handful. I get up before sunrise daily and often to screams and screeches of let me out. Potty training is a complete mess...Eww! I mop my floors usually 4 times before 8 am... They eat everything in sight and even though I took out a second mortgage to pay for all their top of the line toys .. Nothing tastes better than my wooden table or chairs, but they aren't picky they also love feet, clothes, shoes, walls, baseboards ... ETC...

Did I mention that my husband took our adult male dogs hunting ( 3 provinces away for 3 weeks...) so I am stuck with a VERY miserable momma who knows darn well this is hunting season and she didn't go .. LOL 

But at the end of the day after 5 loads of laundry, endless floor mopping, corralling of dogs from one room to the next and very little sleep..( Dont forget a mother to a human kid and a shift worker at a very physically demanding job!) I get to crawl into bed knowing that first thing in the morning or middle of the night .. I will hear that familiar scream of I no longer wanna be in my pen. So sleepily I will crawl out of bed only to be greeted by wet noses, wagging tails and kisses that quickly turn into bites... ooops! stepped in pee... wet socks.. I wouldn't change it for the world.. Dogs make everything BETTER!!

Thanks for listening to my vent ...  Clearly must have needed it! 

Tiffiney


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## doublemocha

Oh you needed to get that out!!! Fantastic post 5crazydogs, loved reading it 

Keep the faith... 3 more weeks.. keep the faith.. 3 more weeks


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## doublemocha

Just providing an update!

We are going to see the puppies again on Sunday, so this will be my 3rd visit since they were born. I speak to our breeder (who I like immensely) every week, it's great to hear about their progress!

We spoke on Friday and yesterday. The puppies are hard work!!! Mainly because there's 12 of them and all of them are thriving, very chunky and active. The cleaning up is constant! Mum is still feeding but gets a bit fed up with all 12, however they are taking to solids really well too. They are 5 weeks now. They manage to find escape routes from their box despite all efforts and are very vocal. There isn't one that is significantly smaller or one which is particularly dominant but they are ALL quite rough, biting and nipping etc!

Will update with some pictures soon


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## NeverGiveUpRAC

How exciting!!!


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## roxy2011

double mocka...dont forget the old pdsa charity shop people throw away brand new teddies and you can pick them up for 50 p 
this is handy considering how strong the v teeth get!!! i always bung them on a aquick wash cycle before roxy has them but its saved me a fortune!!!


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## doublemocha

Roxy - Is it safe to do that? I have visions of him swallowing a plastic eye or some such thing! Not doubting it's a good idea, if someone reassures me it's safe, just that I had discounted doing that and bought dog specific soft toys for this reason?

Thanks 

It it is safe, it will indeed save a fortune!


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## doublemocha

We went to see the puppies today. Life is busy! They have been moved to their heated 'house' in the yard this week as all twelve escaped their box and messed the whole kitchen up! 12 bundles of fur, teeth and energy.

Here's Alfie, don't be fooled by the placid and calm picture, that was about as long as he sat still. Didn't give a hoot about being passed round and handled.


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## doublemocha

Here's another, he has HUGE paws, does this mean he will be big? Did I read this somewhere? He's quite chunky already!


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## doublemocha

Here's another nice one. We have some video too of him exploring. I am quite excited now, starting to feel real.


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## doublemocha

I just have a couple of extra questions please.

Bullysticks - I bought some from ebay from the link provided by Hotmischief, thanks. Is it ok to give these straight away i.e from 8 weeks? Same for marrow bones etc? 

Teeth - what's the advice that people might have regarding upkeep? Do I clean them or will chew sticks etc do the job? Sorry if that's a daft question!


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## hotmischief

Yes you can give the bully sticks and the marrow bone to Alfie when he comes home. However, I would just hang on a day or so and check his tummy is ok with the move. Lots of puppies get loose stools with the change of homes, if this is the case I wouldn't give him a marrow bone, as this can make their poos a little softer any how. To begin with just give it him for 20 minutes and take it away. The taking a bone away is a good training exercise anyway - be firm with him if he growls and tell him NO. To begin with take it away and give it back if he is good - that is the reward.

How many weeks?????to go?


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## doublemocha

Ok, thanks for this  The tip re taking his bone away is useful, thanks.

So, I obviously understand about not taking him out and about until he has been vaccinated etc. I was reading somewhere though about foxes and rats carrying viruses which are dangerous for puppies. Does this even rule out our garden pre vaccination as we live in a rural area? Never seen a rat but do see foxes!

I was/am pretty pragmatic with my kids re dirt. One in particular spent half her childhood on her friends farm amongst all the animals, playing in the beck etc. Can I take a reasonably pragmatic approach with Alfie too? All the dogs I plan on him meeting are fully vaccinated but the garden, well I clearly can't control what wanders in there?! Can we take the vaccination thing to extremes? Would be grateful for advice here.

2/3 weeks to go (depending on when we collect him) Hotmischief, not long now!


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