# Is special protection needed for my unaltered male V?



## Happyhappyhappy (Jan 8, 2013)

My 2 year old unaltered male is a sweetheart. Yes, I've had to step up training at times. Yes, recall is more difficult and we are repeating those lessons. He is more sure of himself and more vocal. But, he seems to be nearing the peak of testing us and falling in line.

We have not decided on neutering, yet.

But, yesterday, my brother in law's 'rescue' cane corse shockingly burst through the chain link kennel door and grabbed at our Vs neck. While my V moved fast, the dog's mass was too much. My V would not back down and my husband was able to intervene before it went further. My V ended up with a single puncture (and rip) on his neck. The other dog was not hurt.

My questions (based upon my brother in law's warnings):
1. Will an un-neutered dog always be a target for other dogs (particularly un-neutered)?
2. Will my V always be a target (trigger) for this dog since this event occurred?
3. Was this possibly play? I believe this dog could have easily killed my dog if he had wanted to do so... So could it have been 'power play'...?
4. Any tips for treating the puncture wound/rip beyond keeping it moist with first aid cleaning fluid and anti-biotic? I also shaved the area to help keep it clean.

Thanks for any guidance. I will neuter my dog if it keeps him safer! But, I will not neuter when training is effective...


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## texasred (Jan 29, 2012)

> My questions (based upon my brother in law's warnings):


Your brother in law adopted a powerful protective breed.
First and foremost, it needs to be kept in a kennel that it can't break out of.
If you read up on the breed, you will see it was not a problem with your dog, but one with his.
No, I don't believe his dog was playing, and your very lucky that your dog only sustained the injuries he did, but yes because the breed is know to be dominant it could have been a power play.


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## R E McCraith (Nov 24, 2011)

HHH- altered or not - a well bred V will always stand its' ground - the ? is this - you put the pup in harms way - avoid it - in a 100ac field - the pup does what it was bred 4 - I HUNT - not your fault - not the Vs' fault - just the wrong place at the wrong time - TIME & SPACE - your V has no clue - but it does know this - with you with him - it will protect YOU !!!!!!!!!!


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## Canadian Expy (Feb 27, 2013)

I am absolutely in favour of keeping our pups unaltered for as long as possible, but we did find that our boy was targeted by unaltered males. There was one attack that was particularly vicious (large male German Shepherd) that I am certain would have left my boy very harmed or dead had my husband not been able to step in and throw the other male off of our boy. In this case, our boy did not stand his ground, he submitted and yelped continuously but the shepherd did not stop. Our boy ended up with numerous puncture wounds around the neck. With puncture wounds it is important to clean them and then squeeze regularly to ensure that they do not become abscessed. Squeezing it keeps it open, and allows it to heal from the inside out. Our boy also ended up having a grape sized cyst form under his skin on his neck due to trauma from the attack which our vet checked for us and drained, so something else to keep an eye on.

Unfortunately, we are only able to control our dogs, so the best thing to do is to keep them away from areas where they may be at risk. The level of risk depends on the area you live. I am in a urbanized area where there are many dogs, and many irresponsible owners. We try to keep our guy away from areas where we may have unwanted off leash encounters, and arrange play dates with dogs we trust. As much as possible we spend weekends out of the city where we can hike and run our boy with little worry. 

As for your brother's dog, this issue with his dog can be dealt with but I would definitely bring in a professional to help. As TR said, the issue is with his dog, not yours. I don't know how long he has had the dog, but it sounds like it him and the dog need training. You and your brother are very fortunate the damage wasn't worse than it was. Whenever we have new dogs over to our place, or take our boy to a house with new dogs we always meet outside on neutral ground and do a quick walk with the dogs. This way we have never had any issues when we return to the home and the dogs accept each other. Something to keep in mind for future introductions to new dogs on their home turf.

We opted to neuter our boy when he was 19 months. It was a terribly difficult decision for us, but due to us living in what we felt is a high risk area we hope we have made the right decision. Our deciding factor was the behavior issues that arose in our boy after the attack. Our previously sweet, easy going boy was terrified when he encountered large male dogs (particularly shepherds and doodles) and I have been working with him on these issues for the past 6 months. The last thing I wanted was for all of our hard work to be undone in an instance due to another attack. 

An isolated incident with our boy (like the incident you witnessed with your brother's dog) would not have caused us to neuter, but we had 3 attacks on our guy, and witnessed many neutered males lashing out at our boy on lead that brought us to the decision.


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## MCD (May 4, 2013)

I can't answer for an intact male. But I do know this. When Dharma was a puppy and was being socialized with other dogs she was rolled on her belly and bitten while off leash in the park. I thought the other dog was her friend from a distance so I chanced letting her go. She got attacked and ran screaming home across a street and I found her huddled between the house and my car shivering.
Many months later we had her at the breeders for a few days while we were out of town. She asked us what had happened as Dharma was exceptionally timid- even around the same breed(her mom too).
She asked me about Dharma's socialization and I told her what had happened. I just have to work that much harder at getting her to deal with other dogs. I am also that much more vigilant about other dogs too. I would probably see if training and protection are effective first. But also your dog is at an age where it has matured and neutering won't affect his health and development either.


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## Dexter321 (Dec 14, 2014)

Hi. I have had the same issue with Dexter. He was being attacked almost every time we went out off lead by male dogs. The only reason we had him done was for these constant attacks. Since then had no issues from other dogs however Dexter is doing the same behaviour being aggressive to some male dogs. This may just be an age thing as now 22 months and just starting to behave himself again after lots of retraining. It's a difficult decision to make.


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## Happyhappyhappy (Jan 8, 2013)

Update: We took Afton to the vet yesterday (cautioned about care by Canadian Expy and having noticed swelling and oozing). Vet gave us a solution to irrigate the puncture wound so it heals properly (trying to avoid a pocket or abscess). He also prescribed oral antibiotics. I learned the hydrogen peroxide is only good in first aid, not wound care (you all probably knew this but I hadn't thought that far ahead).

About the event: I'd like to clarify that the Cane Corso was in a large chain link kennel. We were not visible to him (we were visitors and hoping not to antagonize). The Corso came out of nowhere. Later, we deduced that he had used his mass to break out by repeatedly jumping against the chain link kennel/enclosure gate. The "u" shaped lever twisted (single bolt holding it in place). When all was said and done, the gate was repaired so this cannot happen again. However, we don't go there often and are not eager to go back when the other dog is there (he was a visitor over Christmas, too).


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## texasred (Jan 29, 2012)

Glad you got him on some antibiotics, puncture wounds always have a higher risk of infection. I think a good many vets, and doctors have started using IV fluid to flush dog bite puncture wounds.


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## Watson (Sep 17, 2012)

I also have a 2+yr old intact male, and although he's never been injured by another dog, he does sometimes get negative attention. Like Canadian Expy, we go places where we can hike, and where we're not likely to run into certain types of people/dogs. I also avoid letting him play with certain breeds of dogs (pits/bully breeds), because we've continually had bad experiences with them pushing him around. He can and will stand up for himself, but I don't want to put him in a situation where he has to, because ultimately people look at your dog as being the problem since he isn't neutered. I've decided to keep my boy intact, and although it's a bigger responsibility, it's worth it to me. 

Sorry you had to deal with this. Is Afton shaken up at all?


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## Ksana (Mar 30, 2013)

Someone (RBD?) on this forum was talking about dogs' presumed ability to read our thoughts in a way of images. So, from time to time when approached by suspicious unneutered males, this is the image I am re-creating in my mind. I also try to look and sound that scary too. Visualizing myself as an alpha dog  (well, the best image I was able to find as of today). Any problems with this? Although other dogs seem to back off (well, so are their people, probably, thinking they just avoided one crazy lady), my own boy has started to stay behind me giving me an option "to talk" to other dogs. Prior to this, he had learned to defend himself by showing his teeth, barking and snapping at those dogs, when surrounded in a circle or cornered. I did not want him to be seen as aggressive, but with this new approach I am unsure if this is the best solution. As I also noticed that attacks on my boy occurred every time he hesitated, I thought that other dogs sensed this as a sign of weakness. So I have started trying to encourage my boy with the same commands I use to tell our boy to be nice when he is approaching small dogs (he is very gentle with small dogs). I find this approach working with some dogs (perhaps, as our boy's tail goes up and he looks very happy and confident, other dogs respond positively back). Regardless the approach I choose, it feels like I am on a mission, every time I am in the off leash park


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## Happyhappyhappy (Jan 8, 2013)

Afton (our V) has rebounded fine. He was around another dog today, interested, but he seemed to do as others suggested and look to me. I am laughing at the image of the ware wolf... i, too, believe that we send cues which we do not even realize to our very attuned pals!


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