# Aggression or fear?



## Ozkar (Jul 4, 2011)

Are you faced with an aggressive dog, or in reality, is it more a fear issue?..........

Of late, I've not only read a lot of posts about aggression but also bumped into other owners who are faced with the same question. In a nutshell, what I'm viewing is more often than not a fearful Dog, rather than an aggressive Dog.

People it appears see the behavior as aggression rather than what it really is.........FEAR.

Here's a real life example.

On yesterday's afternoon walk, we bumped into the owner of an 18 month old V/GSP cross and an 18 month old mastif. The mastif attacked Zsa Zsa. It gave no warning just attacked. Zsa Zsa was caught by surprise and yelped in fright. The guy grabbed his dog by the collar and pulled it off while correcting it.

The owner apologised explaining that it was aggressive. I then explained to his disbelief that his dog was not aggressive, but fearful.

He refused to agree. So I told him to let his mastiff go. He reluctantly agreed. It immediately had another go at Zsa Zsa. 

This time however, Zsa Zsa was ready for it. It's pretty funny watching a tiny 22kg GSP sit an 80kg mastif on it's bum. She didn't draw blood, just got over it's neck and pinned it then jumped back to give it room. 

The point is not about Zsa Zsa's reaction, but about how the mastif displays it's fear through feigned aggression.

So, next you think your puppy is aggressive......check the signs....perhaps it's fear.

Thoughts?


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## Kay92 (Oct 19, 2012)

I can agree that some dogs aggression comes mainly from fear. However, I have seen just plain aggressive dogs in my time. At our local dog park there is a black lab, that I personally think is a horse because it is so big, his name is Hank. And we leave every time he comes. A few months ago in the summer he came in and had a mastiff on the ground shaking its neck back and forth. The owners took him straight out of the park that day. 

On the fear side of things my family and I know what that is like. After Riley's hip surgery he has been aggressive about getting his nails done with clippers. We had to start taking him to the vet to get it done. He gets so scared that he will bite people. It takes a muzzle, the vet, and 3 to 4 vet techs to get it done. All this coming from a dog that couldn't hurt a fly, although he would eat fly so I guess I'm wrong there. But you get the point.


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## redbirddog (Apr 23, 2010)

> Generally, we don't approach any dog that wears flat collars and walks in front of the owner.


Datacan, That is a great rule to live by. It is so true. So few dogs out there are really "aggressive dogs" compared to the "fearful" dogs. 1 in 10 would be my guess. A fearful dog is one that doesn't know where it stands in the "pack". Not only with other dogs, but even with its owner. This is a dog that will not be able to figure out how to react to other dogs. Especially on leash. It can't take flight, so his only option is fight, even if that is the last thing it wants to do. So now the humans think it is an aggressive dog.

Good observations Ozkar. I think you might be the one person on HVF that out-walks me.

We have logged 376 miles in the last two months and have come across a lot of dogs and owners that I have gotten to observe in those many miles. : Key word to describe my observations about dog ownership in heavily populated areas: "Clueless".

Is that too general or harsh a statement?

RBD


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## Ozkar (Jul 4, 2011)

Clueless, ignorant, call it what you will, it's a lack of education or knowledge in general however you label it. It's not just your locale either RBD, it's a global thing. I often speak with owners and their self proclaimed "Dumb Dogs" and pity the poor dog. the dog is more often than not, super intelligent and it just has an owner who cannot see that. Such a waste. 

As to some other posters, yep, sure, agree with you that some aggression is exactly that, aggression. But, more often than not what I am experiencing of late is more a lack of understanding about dog behaviour in general in the general populace. Hence this post to help define what aggression really is and the potential that it may be more fear related.

I've been staying with a friend of late who's dog is pretty disobedient. It wouldn't heel, come or sit to command. It's been two weeks of daily walks with me and my dogs it his dog now walks to heel, sits on command and recalls almost 100%. She even knows the wait command from hearing me tell my dogs and seeing them react. She is becoming a much less fearful dog for the experience. She is another example of fear aggression. 

This dog is part Staffy and part Dingo. So it's always going to be a bit weird, but it's always been outwardly aggressive to other dogs. For a while she was quite dominating of my two, till one day she pushed it too far with them and one at a time, they sat her on her arse and reminded her she isn't as tough as she thinks he is. But her fear aggressive tendencies are slowly reducing with the regular walks and training sessions she is now exposed to each day and a little rubbing off of knowledge onto it's owner.....


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## Azeo (Jul 27, 2012)

We go to the country park everyday for off leash walk. Apart from one or two ignorant joggers who feel they have the right to the park, when there is an athletics ground next door. Anyway back to the topic....we encountered a Labrador on the leash, growling,pulling and tugging and the owner was apologetic saying the dog was aggressive. I told him to let him off leash, as I trust in Simba to only release positive vibes as he recognises a threat when he sees one(especially from Benjy; the annoying jack russel) This Labrador clearly was just showing fear. He was let off and they played for minutes on end. The owner was very grateful and I could see the signs of relief and happiness on his face.
Like ceaser Milan said, it's the humans that require training and the dogs rehabilitation.


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## AcadianTornado (Jul 30, 2012)

Perhaps you can enlighten me here:

Whistler goes to dog day care 3 times a week and has been socialized with other dogs since he has been very young.
He's been with older bigger dogs, smaller dogs, young children and older folks as well. 98% of the time he will want to greet people and lick them and be the jolly loving V that we all like. Meeting new dogs on walks is never a problem as he is always curious to sniff out a new friend.

There has been two occasions where he has just gone berzerk for no apparent reason. One was a morning when I was taking him out for his walk and he saw a construction worker with slightly dirty working clothes and boots. The guy was really nice and everything but he just barked at him and lunged for no apparent reason. I wouldn't qualify him as aggressive one bit; was this a fear issue?

The second occasion came last night when I was taking him out just before going to bed. A middle aged man with his boxer-mastiff mix was walking close to us and Whistler just went berzerk. His dog did not seem to show any aggression however he may have showed an aggressive posture that I didn't pick up on. That being said, Whistler just wanted to lunge after him like there was no tomorrow... the barking and energy was just nuts! The guy was, I have to admit, a bit on the strange side (just a bizarre man...) however his dog seemed to be normal and even showing a bit of postured fear. That being said, I still can't figure out what set Whistler off because he has never done this in other situations.

Even when he gets picked on with other dogs when he's playing, he never snaps at them or anything and only becomes a bit more agitated if the pursuant dog is too persistent...

I've read of the 2nd phase of fear, could this be part of it? Or maybe he senses certain things that I am just oblivious...?


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## Ozkar (Jul 4, 2011)

Yesterday was a horrible day for poor little Astro. He had his mettle tested three times. First up was a massive big American staff which dropped by with it's owner where I am staying. It rushed both Astro and Zsa Zsa immediately. I was lucky enough to pull him off before he injured either of my dogs. This dogs wasn't fearful though, just a nasty, untrained and aggressive dog. I would put a bullet in it if it were mine and that's saying something, as I would never hurt an animal without reason.

Then while out walking, Zsa Zsa and Astro were having a wrestle and play, when a large American Staff X American Bulldog and an even larger American Staff misread their play growls and ran in from 50 metres away and attacked Astro. Once again I was lucky enough to be Johnny on the spot and managed to pull the two dogs off Astro without injury. All of course while the dogs owners stood there watching feebling, mumbling a barely detectable command of "leave it"............. If I had my bow there would be two less dogs walking the planet. 

Then when we got home, Steph the fearful Staffy X Dingo, just turned on Astro for no reason as she walked past him. By this time, Astro was well and truly fed up and to his credit he reacted instantly and sat Steph on her arse. Once again, Steph's owner was OK to leave them sort it out till he saw Astro pinning Steph to the ground. I pulled him away and made sure I let Astro make his point. Steph needed to learn that that type of behaviour is not acceptable nd I know Astro will not hurt her, just frighten her. 

Once again, I do not blame the dogs for their behaviour, I blame the owners.....

The older I get, the more I like dogs...........


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## Vida (Dec 26, 2011)

What age is Whistler?
I think adolescent dogs get a bit confused with communication sometimes ( just like humans!) 
Also,a dog has much more heightened senses and can certainly tell about people and their intentions before we can.
Just a thought...


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## AcadianTornado (Jul 30, 2012)

He's 7 months. Born May 23rd


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