# vaccination issues?



## kiki (May 28, 2012)

Has anyone had issues or bad reactions after vaccinating their V? Odie (he's 5 years old) has some routine shots on Sunday, plus a 3 yr rabies vaccine. His previous owner never mentioned any problems with shots, and she was very thorough with giving us information. On Monday, Odie was very sad. His body was hot, he was drooling a lot, gagging and coughing a bit, didn't eat and he just wanted to cuddle. The vet said most reactions to shots happen within 1/2 hour, so she wasn't sure this was a reaction to that. On Tuesday, he was a little better but still not eating, and still a bit hot. On Tuesday night, he threw up and had a very big diahrea problem. After that, he's been back to normal. It reminded me of when we get shots for our kids and how they are feeling feverish and sick the next day. I'm wondering if the rabies vaccine is the one that made him sick since the other shots were ones he'd had in the past? What have other V parents experienced? Thanks.


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## viszlaluv (Mar 16, 2011)

We recently had all four of our V's updated on their vaccines, including the 3 year rabies. We didn't have any issues similar to what you mention, however one of ours did get a bump about the size of a nickel at the injection site that lasted for about a week, but we saw no change in his demeanor. 

Poor little guy. Glad he's back to himself now.


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## hotmischief (Mar 11, 2012)

So sorry to hear that Odie is not feeling so well and I do hope he recovers soon. Sounds like too many vaccines all at once. On the other hand, as your vet said it could be totally unrelated. Unfortunately, I think you will probably never know.


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## Oquirrh the V (Jun 24, 2011)

Did your vet give all the vaccines at the same time/same appointment? I remember that I had to go back about a week later to get another shot for Oquirrh, I think it was the rabies. My vet wouldn't do all the vaccines at once. Maybe ask about that next time. Hope Odie is feeling 100% soon.


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## R E McCraith (Nov 24, 2011)

when PIKE goes for his kennel cough treatment - I get the shot instead of the nassel spray - PIKE hates having his nose fooled with and so do I - just what we do - but as a gun dog his nose is priceless !


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## iwant2fish (Aug 14, 2012)

She wasn't sure it was a vaccine reaction?!?!? Seriously?? This absolutely is a vaccine reaction and you should have her report it. Vets often don't want to because they don't want to run up the statistics on the reality of how many dogs they make sick with the outdated and harmful practice of annual vaccines. Even if she reports it, it's amazing how many manufacturers "lose" the data. 

Are you in the US? The American Animal Hospital Association (AAHA) changed the core vaccine protocol to every 3 years (although studies show that the immunity lasts from 5 years to a lifetime) in 2003. Still, many vets chose to ignore as they don't want to lose the income. I've personally lost a V to IMHA, which is caused by the over vaccination of pets. Unfortunately, I didn't read up on the subject until after we lost our girl.

If I were you I would be very cautious about future vaccinations. I would definitely split up any future vaccinations to at least a few weeks apart. Better yet, read about vaccine titers which test for the antibodies in your dogs blood. The test will show if you dog even needs the vaccine in the first place. Remember, you can't provide "extra protection" by repeatedly vaccinating your dog. You can only subject your dog to the possibility of harmful side effects.

Here is a good article on the subject. http://www.dogs4dogs.com/blog/2011/11/15/new-canine-vaccination-guidelines/ Be sure to read the "adverse reactions" section. Here is the 2011 AAHA vaccination guideline http://www.aahanet.org/PublicDocuments/CanineVaccineGuidelines.pdf if you would like to read it for yourself. If your vet is an AAHA accredited vet, and most are, ask him/her why they don't follow their guidelines? I would love to hear their response.

Good luck and I'm glad your dog is feeling better!


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## MilesMom (Jun 21, 2012)

Poor guy. The only bad reaction we have had with the rabies is that Miles developed a large lump at the vaccination site that took 3 weeks to resolve.


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## Ozkar (Jul 4, 2011)

iwant2fish said:


> She wasn't sure it was a vaccine reaction?!?!? Seriously?? This absolutely is a vaccine reaction and you should have her report it. Vets often don't want to because they don't want to run up the statistics on the reality of how many dogs they make sick with the _*outdated and harmful practice of annual vaccines*_. Even if she reports it, it's amazing how many manufacturers "lose" the data.
> 
> Are you in the US? The American Animal Hospital Association (AAHA) changed the core vaccine protocol to every 3 years (although studies show that the immunity lasts from 5 years to a lifetime) in 2003. Still, many vets chose to ignore as they don't want to lose the income. I've personally lost a V to IMHA, which is caused by the over vaccination of pets. Unfortunately, I didn't read up on the subject until after we lost our girl.
> 
> ...


I am not out to try and challenge you, but sure would like some factual evidence of your comment if your able?


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## hotmischief (Mar 11, 2012)

Ozkar said:


> iwant2fish said:
> 
> 
> > Are you in the US? The American Animal Hospital Association (AAHA) changed the core vaccine protocol to every 3 years (although studies show that the immunity lasts from 5 years to a lifetime) in 2003. Still, many vets chose to ignore as they don't want to lose the income. I've personally lost a V to IMHA, which is caused by the over vaccination of pets. Unfortunately, I didn't read up on the subject until after we lost our girl.
> ...




This is very interesting. My 7 yr old Gt Dane had a mast cell tumour 7yrs ago. We asked for a referral to The Animal Health Trust in Newmarket who are one of the leading research centres for animal medicine in the UK. We saw a veterinarian cancer specialist. One of the things he suggested was not to vaccinate Fergus anymore. Mast cell tumours are related to allergic reaction and the immune systems. Although I have to say Fergus never showed any signs of an allergy to anything. What the vet was saying is that we over vaccinate our pets and to the point that it damages the immune system. So we no longer have Fergus vaccinated. However, we have had Boris our new Vizsla pup fully vaccinated and will continue to vaccinate him for the next two years. 

What I find interesting with alot of information re animal diseases/medicines, is that there is a lack of controlled research into them. Sometimes it is not possible. e.g a suggested link between dry food and cancer. How can you prove a link to kibble other than high percentage of dogs who had cancer were fed kibble. To me that is a load of rubbish as in the first instance a very high percentage of dogs are fed kibble, more than anything else, but more importantly, there is a genetic factor and the enviroment that each has lived in you cannot control those factors. Hardly scientific.

With vaccines and drugs it is possible to collect data on side effects so it is really important that any reaction to a drug should be reported. In the UK vets have a form that you fill out and is sent to a central body who monitor these reports and I guess if they get enough problems with a drug they will pull it from the shelves.


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## iwant2fish (Aug 14, 2012)

No worries, Ozkar. I was skeptical in the past when I heard others mention this too. I believed what my vet at the time (who now vaccinates every 3 years) told me. Perhaps you missed it, but I put a link to the AAHA guidelines in my post, which was a result of numerous studies. I looked through my links and cannot find any actual studies that I have saved (and try to understand them if you can, unless you were a science major), but there are many, many articles on the subject. 

Google Dr. Ron Schultz, who is listed on the report. He is the chair of pathobiological sciences at the University of Wisconsin and is an expert on the subject. Here are a couple of links, the second written by him:
http://www.news.wisc.edu/8413
http://www.puliclub.org/chf/akc2007conf/what%20everyone%20needs%20to%20know%20about%20canine%20vaccines.htm

Also Google Dr. Jean Dodds, veterinary hemotologist. Her bio is at the end of this link http://www.itsfortheanimals.com/DODDS-RESUME.HTM

Not a vet, but noted researcher is Catherine O’Driscoll. Here’s one article that lists studies as you have requested. http://www.dogsnaturallymagazine.com/purdue-vaccination-studies/
Her book “What Vets Don’t Tell You About Vaccines” is excellent and quotes many studies. Another article by her that I have found interesting is this one. She questioned vets regarding pet vaccine practices, their education on vaccines and their experiences in the field. Their responses are here http://www.dogsnaturallymagazine.com/vets-on-vaccines/

Do some reading, form your own opinion and ask your vet what he/she thinks. I asked my current vet his opinion and he closed the door and was honest. He gives very few vaccines to his own pets and certainly does not do them annually. 

*Hotmischief*-I don’t know if you have seen some of my other posts, but we recently lost our male V who had mast cell (but died from an aneurism or blood clot according to our vet). I am thrilled to hear that the specialist you saw advised you not to vaccinate. A dog with mast cell should never be vaccinated. From what I’ve read, vets in the UK and Australia are ahead of vets in the US on this subject. 

I began reading about all of this when Buck was diagnosed with mast cell. I stuck to articles that were written by vets and not ones trying to sell me something. I was amazed how they related back to the commercial pet food industry and over vaccination. I’ll agree to disagree about the food being a contributing factor to canine cancer, but I’ll save getting up on my soapbox for another time! 

Let me finish by saying that I am NOT anti-vaccine. I am anti over vaccination. We recently adopted a 6 year old V with no vaccine history. I did get his rabies done immediately and will titer him for the rest. I will vaccinate him as needed, but will not over vaccinate him.


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## hotmischief (Mar 11, 2012)

*iwant2fish*,

I did read your thread about your vizsla that had a mast cell turmour, and was very sad that you lost him so suddenly. What I found very interesting in your thread (I think it was your thread) was the information that mast cell tumours grow very slowly. The vet we saw didn't mention that.

I actually don't think the vets in the UK are ahead of anybody on over vaccination, unfortunately. The specialist vet that gave me the "no vaccine" advice worked for a no profit research institution. Regular veterinary practises will never say do not over vaccinate a dog for two reasons 1) it is their bread and butter & 2) they don't want to be found responsible if a dog was to pick up a disease that could have been prevented. Although, why they can't just say you do the initial set of vaccines like we do with humans and then your covered I do not know. Vets these days are so commercialised. My last vet (who was Australian) in a space of ten years has four practises and now has a private jet, and the practises are now covered by locums. Which is why I changed vets. My horse vet has a helicopter with a registration VET-1. In my next life I am going to be a vet!!!

My comments re commerical dog food was from a scientific point of view. If I say that both my dogs are fed a raw diet, I think you will know where I stand re commercial food - without going down the route of kibble vs Raw :

Thank you for all your interesting links which I will read tonight whilst my husband watches the endless number of NCIS on TV, etc ;D


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## iwant2fish (Aug 14, 2012)

Really? I've read on other forums quotes from people in the UK and Australia about their vets being limited vaccine. I had hoped that things were at least better there than it is here. I'm sorry to hear that that is not the case.

As for the mast cell, I don't think it was me that said it was a slow growing tumor. Bucky's was originally thought to be a fast growing cyst on his tail. When the vet was removing it, he realized it was not and biopsied it and two other lumps. They all came back as mast cell. 

Glad to hear that you are a raw feeder and yes, that tells me where you stand on the kibble vs. raw issue. That's what we feel kept Buck healthy and caused his tumors to shrink the additional years we had with him. It certainly has made positive changes in our other pets as well. He never suffered one day from the disease that we know of. He was supposed to be gone by 2010. I would never go back to kibble.


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## Ozkar (Jul 4, 2011)

Trust me, Oz vets are very keen to have your pet Vaccinated annually. I am lucky enough to have an old school vet, who often sends me to the supermarket to get a remedy to heal whatever ails my pups. He charges very little. (My best friend's wife works for Fort Dodge who do animal vaccines and supplies my vet. On one of her visits a few years ago, she discovered that he was charging his customers less for the vaccines than she was charging him.... she brought it to his attention..... his prices remain unchanged   )

I will take on board those links and have a read, as well as ask my vet behind closed doors what he thinks. I wasn't be a sceptic, I was just after some facts. I am open minded to most things... apart from freakin E-collars


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## LaVidaLoca (Feb 20, 2012)

Hey is anyone doing heartworm prevention? More in regions with lots of mosquitos....


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## hotmischief (Mar 11, 2012)

*iwant2fish* thank you for posting those links - they were fascinating and although I was already very doubtful re vaccinations those articles give me even more doubt.

I was interested to read the paragraph by the British vet Chris Day, written in the last link "dogs naturally". He has treated my horses for many years. One of my horses is very allergic to a lot of drugs and so I was forced to look at alternative medicine for him. In the beginning I was very sceptical, but the results spoke for themselves. It was interesting about over vaccination causing allergies. With the horse it probably was the cause as I got the dates between the 1st three vaccinations wrong and had to start the whole lot again - otherwise he wouldn't have been allowed to compete. It makes me think maybe I need to look for a holistic vet locally for the dogs!!!

iwant2fish - that is amazing that Buck had a mast cell tumour on his tail, just like Fergus. I took the decission to amputate the tail as we caught it very early, and it has now been 2 years without another lump - hope I am not speaking too soon, if you know what I mean


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## iwant2fish (Aug 14, 2012)

Ozkar-Well again I am very disappointed to hear that the vets in the UK and Australia are NOT ahead of the US on the subject. I wish I had your vet. He sounds like he truly cares for the animals and their owners. He's a keeper.

LaVidaLoca - I am in South Florida and give Heartguard to my pets, but I give it every 45 days not every 30 days. If I lived in a cooler climate I would give it less frequently. I've got links on that too if you would like them.

Hotmischief - glad you liked the links. I did a lot of reading after Buck was diagnosed and asked a lot of questions. It was quite a shock to learn that almost everything I had believed was the right thing to do for our pets was wrong. It was a bitter pill to swallow, but my pets today are certainly better off for it. We would have amputated his tail too if it was the only spot, but it wasn't. We decided against the amputation and chemo as it as 5k and only gave a 50/50 chance of working. Even if it did, we were told it could have come back in as little as 6 months. We decided not to do that to him and just try to make him as happy and healthy as we could for the 6-12 months we were told we had left. The only thing we did was put him on the raw diet and gave him supplements (supplements were per a holistic vet). After he lived a year, we went to our current vet who removed the rest of his lumps (our original vet didn't think they could be removed) and had them biopsied. His cancer was downgraded to stage 2 and he was given a 5-6 year life expectancy. He was diagnosed in October of 2009 and he lived happily until this happened in July. As I said before, he was never sick that he showed us. Not one day. Today would have been his 10th birthday. I miss him so very much. Please keep me updated on your dog's progress.

kiki-sorry to have highjacked your thread!!


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## LaVidaLoca (Feb 20, 2012)

iwant2fish,

why exactly are you giving Heartguard every 45 days? Maybe you can send me the links? I would be quite interested. I'm really against unnecessary medication. I also don't use Frontline and other tick treatment. My dog never had any tick or fleas and she meets a lot of dogs..... 
I'm extremely interested in holistic treatments - on humans and animals. It hurts every time I have to give antibiotics to our pup and the Vets here in Asia are prescribing antibiotics so easily and they always give you a bad feeling with scaring stories when you have doubts or think it's unnecessary.
There are not many vets who approach with good knowledge and common sense to the problems of an animal...that's really sad.


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## hotmischief (Mar 11, 2012)

LaVidaLoca,

I am totally against the use of Frontline and other flee and tick meds. Fortunately, the few ticks that the boys pick up I quickly remove. On Danes it is very easy to spot flees, and we have never had a problem with them on Fergus. However, Boris did have flees and I couldn't see them except for the bites and him scratching so I did use Frontline twice on him this summer. 

If you know of some holistic alternative I would loved to know about it. I hate the idea of putting chemicals into their blood stream which then remain there for up to six weeks.


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## Ozkar (Jul 4, 2011)

I have been told by an old farmer that a mixture of Tea tree oil, normal mouthwash and water sprayed on with an atomiser will keep them off. I haven't tried it, but often old farmers remedies work really well.


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## iwant2fish (Aug 14, 2012)

LaVidaLoca-Heartguard is only recommended every 30 days because the manufactures think we won't remember to give it every 45. More poison in your dog's system and more money for them is what I think of, but I'm sure there are people who do forget. I put a reminder in my phone so I remember to give it. As you may know, there is nothing "preventative" about heartworm prevention. The way it works is that it kills the larvae that are already in your dog's bloodstream, hence what I said about poisoning. I can't find the article I was looking for, but here are two that say the same thing. Read the part about the 57F degree temperature and that's why I would give less if I lived in a cooler climate. My holistic vet that I've consulted with a few times recommends not giving it at all, but living here is South Florida where mosquitos are rampant and heartworm+ dogs are common, I just can't not give it. I wish I knew of a holistic solution, but I don't. If you or anyone knows of one, I would love to hear about it. Here are the articles.
http://healthypets.mercola.com/sites/healthypets/archive/2010/08/03/why-havent-pet-owners-been-told-these-facts-about-heartworm.aspx?aid=CD945
http://www.b-naturals.com/newsletter/heartworm/

hotmischief-Fortunately, we don't have a problem with fleas or ticks, but I do keep Frontline spray around for when we travel. I have never understood why people put that stuff on their dogs every month if they don't have problems.

Ozark-is the formula you mentioned for fleas, ticks or both? Sounds interesting.


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## LaVidaLoca (Feb 20, 2012)

*iwant2fish*,

thanks so much for the links. I will take some time today and read.I'm absolutely on your side about what you're thinking. I wish too I don't need to give heartguard but we live in Asia in the tropics where mosquitos breed all year. We don't have seasons and so I have to give it but I will give it every 45 days too and will put a reminder into my cellphone. I guess for heartworm I can't recommend any holistic solution. :-\

I also can't understand why people put that frontline stuff on their animals. There are so many other solutions to keep ticks away and I would definitely give them a try before using insecticide on my dog. Especially when you have kids and everyone pets & touches the dog. I mean Vizslas have such a short coat - it's so easy to see if a tick is crawling on the dog. 

So as for me - even before we got the dog - I was sure that I won't use Frontline on my dog. So I did a looong research and found other options which are working on my dog. 

I generally have the feeling that people in the US and here in Asia don't question medication on their dogs that much. I don't want to offend anybody but I'm also reading in German V Forums and the dog owners there are more skeptical and do more research on that topic before giving hard medication. They like to give holistic options a try too.

For example, when my pup got bumps from the grass I've read that people here use to give Benadryl or Atarax. So before my parents came to visit us I've called our pharmacist and asked for these medications. She asked me for what and I said for the dog. She said to me that Benadryl is not licenced in Germany. These medications are quite heavy. 

So I told her that we're dealing with bumps and she gave me advice for a holistic treatment. And it works. So whenever she has a allergic reaction from the grass I give her 3 x times a day 5 globule_ apis mefillica D3_ or_ belladonna D3/D6_ which works as well.

Every medication( especially tick treatment ) you give, stresses the organs especially the liver. So after giving heavy medication it's important to make a detox-cure. 

So what I use against ticks is: coconut. It works fantastic. 

If you start - give your dog daily 2 weeks of coconut oil or shredded coconut into the food. ( dogs love it ).
The organic coconut oil has a laurin acid of 60 % which destroys the cysts of vermin. 

Ticks also don't like the smell of coconut. So you can either take a hazelnut-amount in your hands and wipe it over the fur or I did a spray on my own. ( Coconut oil, AloeVera oil, tee trea oil or citronella and and a bit of Neem oil)

So after two weeks your dog will have stored a special amount of laurin acid in his bloodcirculation. After that you can give 2-3x a week to keep the level. 
You can find a lot of research and articles when you google coconut oil on dogs. 

The fact is , Neem and coconut oil work as a repellent. Most medications don't. The ticks only die after sucking the blood. If you put the oil on the coat - it works as a repellent.

Coconut oil is antibacterial, antiviral, and anti-fungal too. 

http://www.dogsnaturallymagazine.com/the-health-benefits-of-coconut-oil/

I can say my dog is tick, flea and worm free since we've got her in march. 

The other thing which works well too is brewer's yeast. 

*Hotmischief* - I know I mentioned it somewhere already and you found out that it also may cause bloat but if you're dog doesn't have any stomach or gas problems you can give it. In Germany most people give it to their dogs, especially the ones who are feeding raw and no one ever mentioned bloat. 

So I give once a day a good filled teaspoon to the dogs food and never had any problems.

Brewers yeast is a great source of B vitamins such as biotin, trace minerals such as zinc, proteins, and amino acids. The amino acids and vitamins can help make your dog's skin healthier and its coat shinier.
Second, brewer's yeast is often recommended by holistic vets to help strengthen dogs' immune systems.
It also works against fleas because it contains sulfur compounds that make your dog less palatable to fleas. 

Some dogs are allergic to yeast, and dogs that are allergic to other foods are likely to be allergic to yeast as well. Low quality yeast is especially likely to cause allergic reactions. If your dog has food allergies, introduce high-quality brewer's yeast into its diet cautiously. If you see any signs of an allergic reaction, discontinue the brewer's yeast immediately.

If your dog has already fleas - one thing which works really well is: silica powder. 

Yes, the one you can get in drug stores as a supplement.

You should wipe the powder into your dog's fur and wait few hours and then wash the dog. The fur will become dry and fizzy but it will kill the fleas. But you should do it outside and avoid inhale.
You can also put some powder on the beddings, carpets and corners - everywhere the dog is lying or sitting. Just don't forget to vacuum after few hours. 

Another extremely healthy oil is black cumin oil ( Nigella sativa ) People use to give it to their horses for shiny coat and against skin problems. It's an immune booster and supports lungs when having cough. I give 7 drops everyday to the dog food. 

I think on google you can find a lot of information about that oil.

Sorry for long post but maybe others are interested too.


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## flynnandlunasmom (May 28, 2012)

LaVidaLoca, I live in New England where Lyme disease is really common in pets and humans. I use Frontline on my dogs. I have tried holistic anti-tick options and they don't work. I will try coconut oil but odds are, I'm not going to stop using Frontline on my dogs because the alternative, Lyme disease, is worse - in my opinion. 

Also, Benadryl is pretty harmless. Even pregnant women can take it. It's probably listed under a different name in Germany.

This is obviously a matter of opinion and all opinions will differ but in terms of ticks, geography has a lot to do with it.


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## iwant2fish (Aug 14, 2012)

Thanks LaVidaLoca, that was an interesting and very informative read. I will try that before we travel to our other home, which has a terrible tick issue in the summertime. I was especially interested interest in the article you included. Our newest V has had a slight dandruff and itch issue since we got him 5 weeks ago. He's now fully transitioned to a raw diet and I thought for sure it would solve the problem. It's better than it was, but he still has it on and off. I began the coconut oil tonight and hope that will solve the problem. I liked that it quoted Doctor Karen Becker too. I follow her on Facebook and love her articles. She's an integrated vet, which is where I think I fit in. I'll always try a natural cure first, but will resort to pharmaceuticals when I absolutely have to. I look forward to reading other posts of yours on natural cures in the future. It's seem you've done a lot of research.


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## LaVidaLoca (Feb 20, 2012)

Hey guys,

everyone thinks he/she does the best for his/her dog(s) - same with the children right ?!  

Here we have lyme disease too but fact is - not every tick is an infected tick. We have "only" one species of tick: the brown dog tick which rarely goes on humans. 

In Germany ticks go on humans as well and you can get the disease as well which can be quite dangerous. 

I've got a vaccination against ticks because I used to be a lot in nature and the area I was living was listed as an heavy infected region. Even the children in my old neighbourhood get up to 10 ticks while playing in the garden...but no one of the parents is going to put a tick medication on the neck of his kids. Just usual tick repellent and of course - most important- checking!!!

So but because of that you can't stay and keep your dog(s) indoors all the time. It's not uncommon that one dog can get up to 30 ticks at once when coming home from the field/woods. Even though most people avoid to use Frontline and similar tick treatment.
They just check their dogs, remove ticks and try alternative options. Again not every tick is an infected tick.

So everyone has to decide which risk he/she takes by not giving or giving tick treatment. 

As for me personally - I'd rather take the risk to have one or two ticks on my dog in a year than giving "unnecessary" tick treatment every month. 

And when you do a proper research you can find reports of really bad side effects and their experiences and they are not uncommon. The companies which invent these kind of products don't want to publish the negative statistics. The industry is too big for that.

Fact is that Frontline doesn't work on every dog and dogs still can get ticks. The tick dies _after _sucking blood - so Frontline doesn't prevent the dog of getting ticks!! 

Some dogs get more and easier ticks than others but I know that a lot of people complain that Frontline is not really working on their dogs.

My dog hadn't any tick in all these months, my alternative options are working - why should I putt that insecticides on?! I also check my dog every day but that would be too much effort for some people. 

Interesting:

http://www.shirleys-wellness-cafe.com/avictim.htm

"Why did the EPA put Frontline Plus for Cats & Dogs on their most toxic list?
An EPA Advisory was distributed over the wire today saying increased scrutiny of flea & tick products for pets was needed because of an increase in reports of adverse reactions. There were 44,000 reported complaints to the EPA about product reactions and 80% of them were caused by only 7 brands from 4 companies. Frontline Plus for Dogs and Frontline Plus for Cats were 2 of the 7 brands!! What is in Frontline that causes so many reactions in cats and dogs?"

http://www.epa.gov/pesticides/health/fle…

http://www.thedailygreen.com/environmental-news/latest/is-frontline-safe-0318

http://greenmomintheburbs.wordpress...s-a-flea-alternative-flea-prevention-tactics/




*Benadryl* contains *Diphenhydramin*.

It's only used ( in human medicine ) as a sedative ( calmative ) medicine when having sickness or vomitting issues.
In the U.S., Diphenhydramin is used as a sedative and sleep medication in a different dosage and also still widely used as an antiallergic agent under the brand name Benadryl , particularly to alleviate hay fever.

Diphenhydramine is also a component of the fixed drug combination of *dimenhydrinate.*

So in Germany and Switzerland the Diphenhydramin is available only in pharmacies and if I'm not wrong on prescription.

Benadryl is in veterinary medicine not allowed since 2003. Has something to do with narcotic law.

*
iwant2fish*

try to give your V 1 Soupspoon of Safflower oil in every meal. I think your itch and dandruff issue should be solved in few days. Works really well when dogs having dry and itchy skin!!


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## LaVidaLoca (Feb 20, 2012)

*iwant2fish*

just wanted to add something regarding your V's skin issue:

Flaxseed oil and rape oil are rich in omega3-fatty acid,

safflower, evening primrose oil and wheat germ oil are rich in omega6-fatty acid.

All these oils are good for coat and skin ( especially evening primrose oil!! ). Brewer's yeast works good too. 
Make sure the oil is cold pressed !


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## hotmischief (Mar 11, 2012)

LaVidaLoca, thank you for your fascinating posts.

I had been wondering why all our US members are recommended by their vets to give Bendaryl, but I have notice that UK members are all recommended by their vets to give Piriton. Both are available over the counter without prescription. Next time I go to the vets I am going to ask why.

My pup has some sort of mild allergy, to what I don't know. He is on a raw diet, and at the moment we are trying an exclusion diet to try and eliminate a food allergy. It mainly effects his eyes (the membrane goes very red), but also some scratching. His skin doesn't appear dry and since he has been on the Turkey only diet he has no hives on his tummy. I personally think it is something in our garden that he is allergic to, may never know what it is. My vet and I both agree the allergy is so minor it is not worth putting him under to take a skin sample to test for allergies.

I do give him 1 Piriton occassionally if he is particually itchy. Do you thing the safflower oil would help his itchy skin?

Once again thank you for your interesting articles. I must print them out and try some of the tick and flee remedies next summer.

Many thanks LVL


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## Ozkar (Jul 4, 2011)

iwant2fish said:


> Ozark-is the formula you mentioned for fleas, ticks or both? Sounds interesting.



All the above plus Mozzies.


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## LaVidaLoca (Feb 20, 2012)

Hotmischief,

I'm happy you "enjoyed" my post  

There's nothing to loose to give harmless alternative options a try before giving medication as a last chance. That's how I handle human health issues as well. 
I'm definitely not a friend of overdosage and overmedication. 

I'm reading in a german Forum which is called Healthy dogs and is a platform for people who are feeding RAW and are interested in holistic treatments. Especially on Feeding/Diet and Health.

Soooo interesting. 

And yes - a lot of dog owner's experience is - that with giving safflower or flaxseed oil ( cold pressed ) the itchy skin gets better. I just bought a bottle of safflower oil yesterday and started to give her 1 Tbsp in her food. 
They say that even evening primrose oil is better...but can't get it here.

I keep you updated 


PS: black seed oil is healthy and effective too. I think on amazon you can find that oil for good price.

http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_s...il+,aps,505&rh=i:aps,k:black+seed+oil+organic


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## hotmischief (Mar 11, 2012)

Thank you so much, will get ordering today!! Will let you know how we gets on.

I am the same as you, try alternative holistic medicine and medicate as last resort for all my pets and myself. I have accupuncture every month and have done so for years and that saves me taking daily drugs - so alternative medicine can work really well.

Heather


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## iwant2fish (Aug 14, 2012)

LaVidaLoca said:


> *iwant2fish*
> 
> just wanted to add something regarding your V's skin issue:
> 
> ...


Thanks! I look into those if you think that they will work better than the coconut oil. He's only been on it a couple of days and his dandruff seems better. However, it comes and goes so we'll see what happens in the next few days.

I look forward to reading your links too. I noticed that the EPA one does not work, but I think the following article probably sums up what the other was saying. Thanks for your valuable information! I'm always reading about animal health and nutrition so it's right up my alley!


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## einspänner (Sep 8, 2012)

LaVida,
Is the German forum vizsla specific or about dog health generally? I'd love the link either way as my German could use a little brushing up. Thanks!


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## LaVidaLoca (Feb 20, 2012)

*einspänner*

when I saw your nickname few weeks ago I was wondering if you have german backround 

The german Vizsla forum has a section about health/illness issues. Quite informative and and surprised me that people/dogs are discussing about different issues than here. Not all topics are different but few.... You have to get an account otherwise you won't be able to see/read the threads.

There's another forum called www.gesundehunde.de which is more about health / diet / holistic for dogs in general. But very very interesting and informative too!! Here you can read most topics without registration.

Happy readings


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## shona (Mar 20, 2012)

Some good tips here. I will give the coconut oil a go thanks as I don't like using many strong medications. We live by fields though and nothing works completely. The dogs are tick checked every night. It's easy to see and remove ticks from the Viszla but not so noticeable on my spaniel.

Also on the itchy skin. Tilda has had an itchy bald spot on her leg for over a year now, she's always chewing it but we don't know why. Anyway the vets have given us various creams, sprays and antibiotics and nothing worked. Then someone mentioned starflower oil to us. Bought some from our pet shop and she gets a teaspoon on her tea every day and finally it seems to be healing, there's some hair regrowth after a year.

I live in the UK and unfortunately they do vaccinate every year. My mother-in-law who taught vetinary nursing told me to get it done every 5 years, after all we don't vaccinate children every year. I always stuck to this and had no problems with the dogs. However now my 2 have pet passports so we can take them to France with us when we go to stay with my dad and we have to get them done every year to keep the passport valid.


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## einspänner (Sep 8, 2012)

Thanks for the link! I'm sure I'll find it very interesting once I get a chance to read through it. 

I'm American, but my family lived outside of Stuttgart for a few years when I was a kid and I did a short study abroad type thing in Wien 2 years ago. My little sister was born over there, the only blonde haired/blue eyed of the three of us--must be something in the water.  

Back to vaccinations and the like.


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