# Vizslas & Barn Manners



## kellygh (Oct 25, 2010)

Pumpkin acts like a fool at the barn. We do not have our own horse farm, so we depend on others being tolerant of P's presence. No matter how many times I've taken her, while not equivalent to having our own 24/7 exposure, she is a pain in the a**! She stalks, bows, spins, jumps, bucks, and basically acts like a nut. She has had a lot of exposure, but I feel like we are making no progress. She, on the other hand, makes great progress in annoying owners/boarders, exciting, spooking, & greatly increasing her chances (probably deserves) of getting her head kicked clean off! In the recent post re: cats, I replied about watching Pumpkin get about 3 feet up a tree, all fours on the tree, after a cat. Well...that was after P chewed through a 15ft check cord tied to a fence post at the barn. I was fetching a crop for my DD & devil pony, and P chased through the ring (not my daughter's of course), & made an unwelcome spectacle of herself. I have quit taking her to the barn, but I would really prefer to have P be a part of our activities. She will be 2 in August. I am discouraged, because I feel like frequent exposure, "growing up," and supervision w/ enforcement is not helping. Any suggestions from those of you who are around horses with your dogs?? I have had & am around lots of dogs/horses, but P is _different_ ???


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## kellygh (Oct 25, 2010)

I wanted to add: When Pumpkin is on lead, she listens, but it's draining. Yes, I know dog training is a lot of time & patience; however, we are not talking about advanced field or obedience work. My goal is just to have P be well behaved enough to not be a lot of effort on lead, or can walk to the car/go to the bathroom w/out P & worrying she has a horse rearing or flipping someone's Jack Rusell. Thanks for reading


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## Aimless1 (Sep 25, 2011)

How frustrating. P must find the farm extremely stimulating with all the sights, sounds and smells.

Don't really have an answer, and thinking "out loud". Will P heel off lead? Is her recall perfect? Does P know whoa? Has P been introduced to an electric collar? If the answer is yes then the beginning of a solution seem obvious.


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## hotmischief (Mar 11, 2012)

Hi Kellygh,

This is a tricky one as first and foremost you do not want your dog kicked. Not only would that upset you and injure/kill your Viszla it would probably be very upsetting for the owner of the horse.

I have always trained my Danes from 8 weeks to wonder around the yard. They learn the word " out" and "close" as they must never come in a stable with a horse in. They come back and fore between the yard and fields (off leash) but they learn to wait at the gate as I don't want them flying around in the field with horses.

That said I only allow my 6 month old Vizsla around the yard. My horses are all home bred and I trust them not to kick, but the dog must learn not to harass the horses. The only time I take him down to the field is when my husband is with me and can keep him on the leash = he is not sufficiently trained that I would trust him to stay close to me.

It takes a lot of time and needs to be done on a daily basis and under supervision from day one. I fortunately only have one other owner to worry about and her horses are also dog friendly.

I think you either need to think of getting a professional trainer to help you, or leave your dog at home. I cannot stress to you enough (you are probably aware of it anyway) of the number of accidents that dogs cause around horses and riders.

I do wish luck as it gives me great pleasure having all my pets together.


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## kellygh (Oct 25, 2010)

Thank you, Aimless1 & hotmischief. It is frustrating. I would rather include Pumpkin in as many activities as possible, but safety for all does come first. I was frustrated when I posted. Pumpkin does heal off lead, without distractions. She has very good recall, without distractions. I generally avoid calling her more than once if I am unable to reinforce the command. It's most always an animal that is a distraction. At the barn, it is the open fields, all birds, occasional cat etc. Being a V, Pumpkin does everything with just a little bit more "yee-haw" than other dogs. I think you hit the nail on the head, Aimless1, and I just need to be refocusing on training/commands. P has an e-collar. I started having her just wear it to get used to it. I did that for about 2 wks, and then I got distracted with taking care of an elder out-of-state, her estate stuff, kids etc. I will get back to the basics. Hotmischief, you are so right about being cognizant of dangers, and that's why I quit taking P. It wears me out : It will take a ton of work for me to begin to trust P at the barn. Thank you for your insight. It sounds like you have a lot of experience. Pumpkin is a great dog, like no other I have ever been around, and her shortcomings are more about me than anything. Thanks y'all !


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## datacan (May 15, 2011)

Any undesirable behavior can be stopped in about 5 minutes... Question is do we have the guts to apply the necessary pressure?

E-collar is harmful if the dog out of control and too many corrections are necessary. 
I would put the prongs on the dog and walk around the area, correct when necessary. Prongs give instant and constant feedback.

On the other hand, the E-collar is ON/OFF type and may confuse the dog if used too many times. Heck it will shut down and just lie on the ground.
E-collars are more effective if used intermittently. That is 3 times no correction, 4th time dog gets a correction for one specific misbehavior. Generally we have a window of about 2 seconds. 
Gunnr mentions 10 seconds in an earlier post, maybe, it depends on the dog but GSDs get 2 seconds after which a correction is futile. Dog will not understand why it is being corrected. This is the reason I like the prong collars for basic training.


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## texasred (Jan 29, 2012)

Any command that can be taught first on a lead can be transferred over to an ecollar.
Mine wear them on every hunt and anytime they have free run. Now there are lots of days they are never even nicked with the collar but its there just in case.
Plenty of the dogs are ran with people on horse back so P just needs some training.

Any training tool can be over used and make a dog shut down.


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## jld640 (Sep 29, 2010)

Hi kellygh – Savannah goes to a barn about once a week. She used to tear around quite a bit, but she has settled down. I can keep one eye on her instead of two. Part of it is just growing up (she’s about the same age as P). Part of it is familiarity. It took a long time for the barn to be one of her ‘normal’ places. Part of it was ‘things’ I did and ‘things’ that happened. Here are a few highlights – take whatever you can from them.

When we first started visiting, she was ev-er-y-where. After a few visits, everywhere included her first encounter with the electric fence. She is not e-collar trained, so the experience was formative.  She started paying attention to what others (people, dogs, horses, cats) were avoiding and has not been shocked since, but she became far more aware of others in the barnyard.

Since I couldn’t trust her in the barnyard by herself, she came into the barn when it was time to get hay and grain for the horses. Coming back out, the horses would all be waiting by the door to go inside. At the first sight of those horse noses coming down at her, Savannah went from being ready to play to cowering behind my legs. I’m not fond of fear training, but when it came to these horses, any tool was worth evaluating and, in this case, I controlled the terms. Now she scoots outside before the horses group at the doorway.

Cats are at the top of the hierarchy at the house and I spent the better part of several visits to the farm reinforcing the concept that barn cats are also at the top of the hierarchy. They were more helpful with the lessons than my Kitty because they were quite happy to hiss and swat at Savannah.

As a last ditch effort to get her attention and used as a ‘barn-only’ response, I started throwing one of my gloves at her if she is too focused on something else to hear me. My aim is deplorable, so I never hit her. The glove hitting the ground next to her now has an instantaneous affect of getter her attention. That at least gives me a few seconds for her to hear ‘leave it’ or ‘come’. I actually like the idea of a barn-only action on my part; although, I’m not sure I would recommend throwing something because of the potential for spooking horses. I suppose this is the flip-side of the coin to the ‘crate-only’ treats when we were crate training. Regardless, it works for us.

I’ve also had to leave her there on a few occasions while I tended to something else. She was being watched by someone, so I wasn’t worried about her. She, however, didn’t know where I was and that put her on her ‘guest’ behavior. Some of the good manners stuck even on subsequent visits. 

From your description, none of these things will apply directly to P, but I hope you might get an idea from something I wrote. If you do get a good idea, please let me know. I’m always looking for ways to let her enjoy the farm and still be safe.


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