# First off-leash



## Nelly (Feb 7, 2013)

Well first off I must confess that I am a rubbish member - I didn't take any photos! 

Nelly had her first off-leash walk yesterday, wow, what a treat to see my baby V's clumbering puppy run free on the beach, chasing a ball, playing with other dogs and pointing at ducks.

We trained her to 'touch' (come back to us and touch our hand) while on the longline and 'leave' (any yucky things) which she did very well yesterday. 

Over the length of the beach she stayed within a good distance of us and turned back regularly to make sure we were still there, very proud. 

Our breeder told us under no circumstances to let her off before 6 months. I am not a breeder and no expert, but I don't see the harm as long as the area is safe and us the owners are vigilant (hence the lack of photos!) 

It's not like she is only ever going to walk on-leash. She needs the experience and the environment in which she can be truly trained, distractions and all.

What age did everyone else let their pups off-leash?


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## candi30 (Jan 2, 2013)

We had Darby off leash at about 3 months (maybe 2.5 months) for little stints. 
Now we go to the off leash park regularly and she is great. We really worked on her recall so she always comes when we want her to. 
It is awesome the first time you let them off.


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## datacan (May 15, 2011)

Yeah, but the breeder never mentioned how long a leash you can use 
Point is for them to learn to obey without resorting to heavy discipline. You can ignore the breeder at your peril. Be prepared to use some heavy language upon recall... Unless you can control the stimuli present in the environment. 

http://www.gundogsupply.com/orcheccorbym.html

I let Sam off leash the day we brought him home... But that was in a fenced in school yard... Boy I learned quickly how litter can distract a little dog. Ended with me picking up all kinds of trash wrappers, styrofoam, paper wrappers... 
Who knows what else he ate. 

Lesson learned... Put the boy on check cord. Much safer for the dog.
My friend's GSP ate chocolate found on the road and ended up in the hospital. 

Even on a short leash, drop it can be a challenge, off leash, it could be a nightmare... Unless the area is totally clean.


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## giandaliajr (Nov 24, 2012)

We took berkeley up to central park a couple weeks ago during off leash hours, i think he was 18 weeks old. He did great. For the most part he would come running back if we called him. Sometimes if he was playing with another dog he wouldnt come but he never bolted at any point.


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## Nelly (Feb 7, 2013)

Thanks datacan for the advice and link, love that website! Where we are there are clean areas and non-clean areas although I'm still vigilant wherever we are as Nelly has a penchant for chewing gum (eugh). We also took her to a fenced in school play yard and let her off there.

Any idea why the breeder said not before 6 months? I thought it was an over exercise thing but then on the breeder's diet sheet we have '15 mins max off lead is ample, lead walk is fine'. 

Giandaliajr, that's awesome that Berkley was so good. Since it was her first time we put Nelly back on-leash when we caught sight of a dog in the distance, only because we could tell that they were mostly senior canine citizens.


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## datacan (May 15, 2011)

Dogs love routine and once they get conditioned to you having control over them even at longer distance than 6ft, then the chances of them obeying will be much increased. By 6 months they are pretty much conditioned, at least a good foundation is laid.
Distance matters, they know if they are out of range no one can interrupt them  They are three year olds, all the way...

Off leash is a problem for most dog owners and just like with potty training consistency is the key. With a cord I can reel him in and by that enforce most commands. Dog gets used to it by 6 months. 
At 24 months I still put him on the cord from time to time.

Not cool looking and honestly cumbersome but good quality rope cord (probably a 15ft maybe 20ft at the begining) sure makes things predictable haha ;D

Of course, a pair of soft, comfortable, leather work gloves is good to own, keeps hands clean.


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## Nelly (Feb 7, 2013)

Brilliant thanks datacan. Do you let it go and then just pick it up again when you need to reel them in?


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## datacan (May 15, 2011)

Right, that is one option. 

I tend to err on the side of caution and if I think it's too dangerous, I just let him off the lead. I can always go and pick him up rather than call and fail. That way the dog will not learn to hear me calling and ignore. Some will just walk away hoping the dog will follow, but I prefer to go up the dog. If he came in on it's own, that is bonus. But with distractions I don't expect it just yet. Repetition will accomplish that part. 

Yet another option is to not let go of the cord. Then from time to time I just whoa him. Took longer a little but that is how we learned to whoa (or whoop or stop)... Swiss Army knife of all commands. ;D
A unique whistle blow can be also used to release the dog. Some tap on the head, others use two whistle blows. 
In any case, dog cannot move forward until released. 

This is basic groundwork to transition the dog further. Easy on the dog and easy on the owner.
Kind of a combination between hunting dog training and basic obedience. 

Bottom line, the dog doesn't get to decide anything until we approve first. 
It's all about setting them up for success through constant repetition.


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## Nelly (Feb 7, 2013)

Oh wow I just got to this after posting on another thread about setting up for success! 

I am of the same thinking that I don't want to call her and she ignores so would rather go up to her, although she does respond very well to the touch hand command... for now! 

I love this whoa, I started it with her a while back when I first asked you about it, she's starting to get it, will be a good head start for her bird training as well. 

Thanks for the info, I am just about to invest in my new (second) best friend the cord!


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## WillowyndRanch (Apr 3, 2012)

Nelly said:


> Our breeder told us under no circumstances to let her off before 6 months. I am not a breeder and no expert, but I don't see the harm as long as the area is safe and us the owners are vigilant (hence the lack of photos!)


That's interesting to me. I'll wager from the descriptions and advice the breeder is not greatly involved in developing a working gun dog.

I have three Pups from our last litter here who are now about 14 weeks old. They are rarely "on leash" and have been having Off leash explores since they were 7 weeks old. We really only use a leash to lead them to the field and back or for the Vet visits. They get to run free in the fields daily, explore and expand their horizons. Regardless where one goes there is trash and they need to learn to leave it alone. Most times they learn by trying it and deciding they don't like it. That is why they're there - to experience all of it and learn this doesn't taste good, that pokes their mouth,etc. Where we run there is little trash, but some blows in on the wind, or left behind by who knows. Our runs are in the field and they learn about cover, insects, twigs, weeds and the like. In little time they learn that birds are more exciting than a cricket and Mom or Dad is always nearby. When they get thirsty, we have a drink for them. When they come back to us, there might be a bird nearby so it's good to go back to Mom and Dad. They don't want to lose us and by learning that very young, it is always in them - even if independent and running large, they work to keep track of us, and we them. We are always a unit, a pack or a team depending on verbage. FWIW, Waiting until the dog is an adolescent 6 months seems totally backwards and a very un-natural way to train to me. 

Ken


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## texasred (Jan 29, 2012)

Ken has the property and the calmness to let big running pups develop into big running dogs.
I don't see him running around a field panicking every time his pups range out, or trying to call them in when they are in hot pursuit of something that caught their eye.
All things I have seen inexperienced owners do.

Mine run on check cords a lot when young. Due to the fact that they are on property that may only be 40-50 acres and have a busy roads on all four sides. If I'm out on a few hundred acres of prairie, then taking the cord off means they will range out, and you can really see them run. I just don't call them unless they are already headed to me.

I believe free running a pup depends more on the property, and the willingness of the owner to let the pup figure out whats good and bad on there own.


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## R E McCraith (Nov 24, 2011)

MY pups are born off leash and pass on that way - as soon as you get your pup start teaching HERE - very simple - every time the pup turns and comes to you raise your hand and say HERE - when he gets to you - lots of love - then throw in hide & seek - then the whistle - I use 3 blasts for HERE & 1 blast when teaching whoa - use 1 blast for whoa because I use it more in the field - PIKE runs large - but every 2-3min he checks back to see were I'm at - it all starts the day the PUP comes home !!!!


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## Nelly (Feb 7, 2013)

Indeed, TexasRed, I see people do this constantly on our beach and putting their dogs back on every 200 yards or so. 

We will be getting a check cord due to the large volume of dog walkers in the area putting their dogs back on as soon as they see other dog walkers in the distance, although I can normally tell by the dog if it is out of courtesy or safety. We also have some busy roads around and on the way there.

Ken, yes, funny how that didn't dawn on me until you said it. The immediate dogs in the line are mostly show. I would have liked to start this a lot earlier because as you said, they need the experience and of course by that time she will be a teenager. 

I am going to keep training her up on it now with the check cord rather than waiting till 6 months and I sincerely appreciate everyone's advice. 

Ken, one day I will live on a ranch and all my V's will be running free from day one, can't wait! ;D


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