# Lots of poo....



## katscawn5 (Nov 28, 2014)

Hi all, 
I haven't posted on here for ages, and have just had to start a new account as I had forgotten all my old details... 
Anyhoo, Reuben (our nearly 3 year old v) is on Arden grange adult large breed and has been for ages. The problem is is that he poos A LOT, I'm talking up in the tens (he has never been on anything else to know any different but even friends are saying how much he poos - it can't be right!!)! Usually starting firm but by the end of the walk they are super sloppy (not diarrhoea, but loose) - I know that as they run about excitement/adrenalin causes loosening. 
So my questions...
1. Has anyone else experienced this with Arden Grange?
2. Will changing him to the sensitive formula help?
3. Should I change him to something different entirely (am aware that this could create more issues) 
4. Is this normal???
Thanks in advance 😃
Kat


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## organicthoughts (Oct 9, 2012)

Not normal but experienced by many kibble fed dogs.

You can try adding a bit of pumpkin to his food, or do a total switch and change him to a raw diet.

My pup was on kibble originally and had the same issues. At 8 months I switched to raw and never looked back. Bowel movements were immediately improved and he is healthy all around.


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## Spy Car (Sep 3, 2014)

It is the grain in the kibble. The carbohydrate-load in kibble (including the one you are feeding, I had to look it up, but did) is not a natural or species appropriate diet for a dog. So if you feed it you will get lots of waste, because there is a lot of "waste" in the diet.

The carbs will also do a number on the dog's teeth. Heavy carb diets lead to tartar and periodontal disease. 

Like Organicthoughts I'd suggest looking at a raw diet. You'd be astonished at how little waste you'll see with a raw diet (as the nutrients are very bioavailabe , well assimilated, and species appropriate.

I started my (now) 7.5 month old male (Chester) on raw at 8 weeks (day one that we had him). I'm more and more convinced by the day—which ain't easy given I've been totally sold for sometime—that this was an outstanding decision for my dog's optimal well-being. He has a vibrancy of health on every level (clear eyes, gleaming ultra-white teeth, fresh breath, lustrous coat, and a hard-lean strong body). Raw fed dogs poop (obviously) but they are small and don't generally smell. 

Otherwise, the less cereal in the food the less copiously the poop will be produced. Less cereal will good for general health. As a general rule the more poop the lower the quality of the food, and vice-versa.

Bill


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## katscawn5 (Nov 28, 2014)

Thanks for the help! From what I have read raw is the only way 😕 
How do you do it? 
Kat


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## lyra (Nov 2, 2012)

I feed both our dogs on the same Arden Grange kibble and they usually go twice a day with firm stools.

Clearly it doesn't suit your dog and you should look for an alternative. Raw is certainly one, but not the only option. You could try a kibble with no grain. There are also kibbles like Orijen Adult Dog that have a high protein low carb recipe. It is a lot more expensive (good quality protein costs) but is designed to recreate a more 'normal' dog diet.


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## katscawn5 (Nov 28, 2014)

Hi all, 
Sorry for no response, managed to lose the forum! Doh! 

Anyway, the saga continues... Managed to put him on a cooked complete, but he is a hungry dog and it would have worked out at £60 a month 😨 no way would hubby go for that (food, insurance, balls, etc = £100 to keep him a month ouch!) anyhow, started to mix the cooked with a gluten free kibble and a little raw... All went great for about 2 weeks, we were down to 2-3 poops a day, no constant pestering to go out, and no wind! And now we are back to mega pooing dog again 😢. I have now cut the raw and am going with the cooked, a local brand called forthglade ( not complete) and autarky biscuits (complete) but it doesn't seem to be working - in fact I'd say it's getting worse, bless him.. We are back up to 10 poos a walk and it's like he can't control himself (although so far no pooing in the house) I am seriously at my wits end. Walking him is just stressful and my husband gets really annoyed which makes it even more stressful - obviously it's not the dogs fault and I am sure he gets fed up with the constant pooing.... 😞 any ideas...

Thanks in advance


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## mswhipple (Mar 7, 2011)

I'm by no means an expert on doggy diets... in fact, I've been very lucky with my boy Willie. I switch his food around from brand to brand in a regular rotation. In this way, he has never developed a sensitivity to any particular food or ingredient.

Is it possible that your Reuben has some sort of a food allergy? I know money is an issue, but maybe a trip to the vet is in order. You might need help to narrow it down, once and for all. Food allergies are not uncommon. Good luck!!


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## katscawn5 (Nov 28, 2014)

I have considered this, but excessive pooing and even diarrhoea (not that he is having that) are not indications of food allergy, plus diet is actually not usually the cause of an allergy... In himself he is fine, bright eyes, good skin, lovely shiny coat (even better than when he was only on kibble)
I was considering trying grain free food, not just gluten free.. Just want a quick fix as it is getting worse 😔


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## hotmischief (Mar 11, 2012)

I have to agree with Spy Car and Organicthoughts. The grain is probably irritating his bowel, and quite frankly feeding cooked meat is a waste of time. I notice you live in the UK. I feed 2 male wirehaired Vizslas on raw for £75 a month. I do blitz my own vegetables. Not sure where you are getting your raw from but it might be worth your while having a look at these two sites which do next day delivery all over the UK and depending on what you buy, it is very reasonable, both do specials and if you have a large enough deep freeze you can do it quite cheaply.

http://www.nurturingbynature.co.uk/barf_natural_raw_dog_food_bournemouth_s/1814.htm

http://www.daf-petfood.co.uk/4-daf-frozen-dog-foods

If you want help and advise with feeding raw there is a very good group on Facebook called Vizsla Raw and Natural. This group has quite a few nutrionalist who contribute and everybody is very supportive.

Personally, I have found that a raw diet cost no more than a good quality kibble. However, I do understand that not everybody can / or wants to feed raw and I would therefore suggest that you look at grain free kibbles such as Acana and Orijen.


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## katscawn5 (Nov 28, 2014)

Thank you for that. I have given him raw, but he is super fussy and won't eat it on it's own - any suggestions?! I had wanted to avoid having to cook separate veg, as I understand that pet store bought is just mince and they need veg etc. for fibre, is that right? It's really a time constraint - Young kids, job, life, etc! 

Thanks for those website links, I will take a look, I do try to support our local pet store, I think he charges 85p for 454g of mince in a selection of beef and tripe, lamb, chicken, etc. the issue with £ was looking at a cooked complete that would work out at £2 a day, and then factoring in insurance.. All just adds up! 

I grew up with a lab... Explains my exasperation with dietary issues 😝


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## katscawn5 (Nov 28, 2014)

Can't seem to find that vizsla Facebook page, could you clarify for me please, would be really interested in what they have to say, thanks.


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## einspänner (Sep 8, 2012)

Here's a link to the page. Vizslas, Raw and Natural https://www.facebook.com/groups/277508778962425/


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## hotmischief (Mar 11, 2012)

I can sympathise as my pup can be a bit fussy. Firstly, no point in feeding cooked vegetable , they do not digest them. They must be raw and they must be blitzed as dogs are unable to break down the cells in veg. They only need about a tablespoon a day. I do a whole batch of whatever fruit and veg is going cheap or we haven't eaten and then freeze them in tubs. So if you don't have the time for that just add a couple of shots of salmon oil.

The other thing you can try is sprats - they are very cheap in the supermarket - £3 Kg. I buy a couple a kilos and split them into bags and you can feed them frozen or defrosted - even the pup loves them. Try buying chicken wings from your pet shop, or anywhere that does them cheap. Natures menu do a nice big bag and again you can feed frozen or defrosted. Great for his teeth and it will help you get bone into him which will really help his poos. If you can get him to eat wings and chicken carcasses then that may be enough.

Have you tried him on Fotherglades tripe - they normally love that?

Try this link to the FB group. There is also a Vizsla Health Information group which you might find interesting.

https://www.facebook.com/groups/277508778962425/

If the above doesn't work do a search under groups.


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## katscawn5 (Nov 28, 2014)

We've gone completely raw, currently on forthglade beef and tripe, which he loves! Down to 2-3 poops a day and everything seems to be settling down, he's still a bit of a beanpole but I am over feeding him in the hopes that he will start to put on.
Such a relief that it all seems to be working out - kinda wished I had put him on raw from the beginning, hindsight hey! 
Thank you all for your help!


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## hotmischief (Mar 11, 2012)

My 17 week old pup is now being a bit fussy, sometimes misses a meal altogether. I am not too worried as he looks well covered and I suspect that part of the problem is that he is teething and his adult teeth are coming through.

A very knowledgable friend told me that if he skips a meal to give him up to half a pint of full fat GOATS milk with some honey in it. He loves this. Some days I give him the milk with a raw egg beaten into the milk plus a raw chicken wing for lunch - he never turns his nose up at that.

Glad yours likes the tripe that will really help him put on weight and is so nutritious.


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