# bit miffed .... puppy classes are they for Viszlas?



## Ruthie_67 (Jan 25, 2014)

My 18 week old viz has just completed his 3rd week of 'puppy classes' I have had a few remarks from the instructor about his lively behaviour the latest two being "vizsla puppies are a nightmare" and the second being "viszla's do like the sound of their own voice don't they." Neither remarks have been helpful or said kindly. In a class of 8 various breeds he does stand out from the crowd, he is incredibly sociable and can't understand why he can't play with the others, he just wants to run around and have fun, in fact at times I call him my little kangaroo. At home he is very good, knows all the basic commands, knows I'm the boss and treats us all gently and respectfully. He sits and waits to be greeted, he does not jump up and is completely house trained. My question is (after the rant) do puppy classes benefit this breed? He responds far better with less distraction and positive reinforcement. This is our first dog, let alone Viszla, and I am beginning to see the difference when I see him with other dogs - he's massively intelligent but very wilful. Do you have any advice for me out there? Ruth :-\


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## Watson (Sep 17, 2012)

Hi Ruth! Puppy classes were a nightmare for us too. We dreaded every Saturday at 1:30 for 8 weeks!  

We had similar feelings, but decided to just stick with it for our pups benefit. We weren't learning anything new and Watson had everything that was being taught down in the first two weeks we had him, so he was quite bored. At the end of our classes there was about 10 minutes of socialization where puppies were paired up by similar energy levels/temperament and were allowed to socialize. This was the best thing for Watson, as he was often paired with a golden who was a few months older than him, and learned quite a bit from that. Other times he was too rough and was kicked out of playtime, which was also a good learning experience. 

If your instructor is making comments like that, I would have a chat with him/her privately, and just let her know her comments aren't really helpful and that you are trying. If she's unwilling to work with you, it might be better to find another puppy class to attend.


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## MilesMom (Jun 21, 2012)

I would find another puppy trainer. Our trainers have been very supportive and loving to the dogs and I think this is important. I would also give that feedback to the trainer when you switch!


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## texasred (Jan 29, 2012)

> Do you have any advice for me out there? Ruth :-\


Yes the trainer is a snot. If you and your pup enjoy the classes(other than the remarks) finish them. As we all know Vizsla puppies are busybodies, with short attention spans, and energy to spare. They are also very smart, the combination of qualities can make it tough on a instructor.
It takes a smart instructor to be smarter than these dogs.

Its great that you have a bold puppy, and I wouldn't let someone's remarks slow down you being able to socialize him.


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## dextersmom (Oct 29, 2013)

Ditto what they ^ said  We had the same experience as Watson, but we didn't have the socialization part so it was a lot of sitting around teaching Dexter stuff he already knew... and we all know vizslas aren't the "sitting around" type! We were allowed to bring Kongs, bully sticks, etc. to keep him occupied but of course, you have to be careful if you have those things around other dogs who might guard, etc. 

We ended up having to find another trainer after our puppy class for behavioral stuff and the first class turned out to be a waste of time. We stuck it out but ended up with a lot of bad habits from the first trainer who really wasn't all that qualified and couldn't handle vizslas. We hated attending the first class but love our sessions with the new trainer. 

So yes, I'd say they can be beneficial, but only if you find a good trainer/class! It sounds like you might want to make a switch if you decide to continue with puppy classes. A trainer that really knew what they were doing wouldn't make such comments, IMO.


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## Ruthie_67 (Jan 25, 2014)

Thanks all for the encouragement, I won't give up the classes, as a new dog owner they are beneficial to me, I just feel the breed is misunderstood which is sad. I don't want to break his spirit but to embrace it! Things like lead training are good, the rest he already has sussed, when he feels like it ...! We too have socialisation time at the end, this is his favourite part, where he lies on the floor just waiting for all the pups big and small to come over for a rumble  Good to know I am not alone with my "nutter" (another word used to describe him by instructor!)


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## redbirddog (Apr 23, 2010)

Bailey and Chloe both flunked "puppy class". Good for socialization.


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## WillowyndRanch (Apr 3, 2012)

Intellectual Property removed by Author.


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## riley455 (Aug 27, 2011)

Ruthie_67 said:


> My 18 week old viz has just completed his 3rd week of 'puppy classes' I have had a few remarks from the instructor about his lively behaviour the latest two being "vizsla puppies are a nightmare" and the second being "viszla's do like the sound of their own voice don't they." Neither remarks have been helpful or said kindly. In a class of 8 various breeds he does stand out from the crowd, he is incredibly sociable and can't understand why he can't play with the others, he just wants to run around and have fun, in fact at times I call him my little kangaroo. At home he is very good, knows all the basic commands, knows I'm the boss and treats us all gently and respectfully. He sits and waits to be greeted, he does not jump up and is completely house trained. My question is (after the rant) do puppy classes benefit this breed? He responds far better with less distraction and positive reinforcement. This is our first dog, let alone Viszla, and I am beginning to see the difference when I see him with other dogs - he's massively intelligent but very wilful. Do you have any advice for me out there? Ruth :-\


I would look for another trainer who has experience with hunting/pointing dogs. I was fortunate with a Petco trainer who hunts with her GSP so she was able to effectively handle Riley. A trainer with relevant experience with this breed will tremendously benefit your puppy.


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## MisterRed (Mar 29, 2013)

Mr. Red and I attended two levels of puppy obedience - he was 16 weeks at the time and was very EXUBERANT to say the least, and at the end of the first eight week session, he was awarded the "Most Improved' ribbon, which he promptly ate!!! I am happy we took these classes although they were a bit stressful at times due to the V energy, but in the end worth it. We have a very obedient exuberant V!!


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## dextersmom (Oct 29, 2013)

WillowyndRanch said:


> Putting down a breed or dog that is unruly is a defense mechanism to save face for the "trainer" that doesn't know how to deal with a smart, energetic dog in my opinion.


Yup, well said. Although I will say our first trainer was not from a big-box store and was actually more expensive than our current trainer. You don't always get what you pay for


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## mlwindc (Feb 8, 2013)

I would recommend finding a new trainer and/or stopping these classes. I don't think your pup is going to be negatively impacted, but you don't need to subject yourself to this kind of behavior and attitude. If you can get credit for the classes and transfer to another sessions with a different instructor, i would try to do that.

To be honest, our trainer (that we are currently boarding Wilson with for the MONTH) has made some unpleasant comments about vizslas. But, he's a trainer who trains dogs to hunts and has had vizslas of his own for years. He no longer has vizslas (hunts with german shorthairs now) because, in his words, they are "too boisterous, too vocal (whining, not barking), high maintenance, and needy." Yes, it did give me some pause in terms of whether to leave Wilson with him, but at the end of the day, all those comments are TRUE (especially of my Wilson) and it's clear he loves the individual dogs, just prefers the GSP traits more.


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## mlwindc (Feb 8, 2013)

MisterRed said:


> Mr. Red and I attended two levels of puppy obedience - he was 16 weeks at the time and was very EXUBERANT to say the least, and at the end of the first eight week session, he was awarded the "Most Improved' ribbon, which he promptly ate!!! I am happy we took these classes although they were a bit stressful at times due to the V energy, but in the end worth it. We have a very obedient exuberant V!!


I love this story. Mr. Red is quite the character.


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## Ruthie_67 (Jan 25, 2014)

WillowyndRanch said:


> I agree with other posters - I would pull the instructor aside and "splain" a couple things to him/her. Putting down a breed or dog that is unruly is a defense mechanism to save face for the "trainer" that doesn't know how to deal with a smart, energetic dog in my opinion.
> 
> I may be incorrect, but I wager the puppy class is held at a big box pet supply store? My experience with them is that there is very little requirement to be a "trainer" and though there are a few good ones, there are a lot of trainers that lack much depth in their knowledge and often have "iffy" personal interaction skills as well. But they are inexpensive - you can get 8 or 10 weeks for what I charge an hour.
> 
> ...


Ken are you a spy? Absolutely spot on!


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## Ruthie_67 (Jan 25, 2014)

Perhaps I'm being a bit of an over protective Mum ... Just want everyone to love him as much as I do ;D Will finish the classes and mention it to her if things don't improve ... Perhaps she's just jealous?


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## dextersmom (Oct 29, 2013)

Our first trainer made similar comments and I really think it was just because Dexter embarrassed her  She couldn't handle him or offer any solutions when he was acting up and it didn't make her look very good...


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## mlwindc (Feb 8, 2013)

Ruthie_67 said:


> Perhaps I'm being a bit of an over protective Mum ... Just want everyone to love him as much as I do ;D Will finish the classes and mention it to her if things don't improve ... Perhaps she's just jealous?


I don't think you are being overprotective... if someone made comments like those about my dog or kid, I would go mama bear on them! Truth be told, most people who don't know vizslas probably think they are totally insane dogs. I am surrounded by people who have goldens and when I tell my crazy vizsla stories, they have no idea what to say. One of my coworkers does have a pair of vizslas who are about 6 and I do remember the first time I asked her if her dogs were "a bit high strung." She just said, "they are f-ing crazy, but we love them" and then we bonded over our crazy lovable dogs. It's a vizsla owner thing. ;D


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## einspänner (Sep 8, 2012)

While I completely agree that your trainer is being a jerk and unhelpful, she also has to make sure the other puppies get enough attention and that can be difficult with a rowdy vizsla around.  Are you tiring your puppy out at all before class. Doing that just enough to take the edge off should help his focus in class. 

I hope you find a better trainer, but don't worry too much about puppy classes for actual obedience training. Like others have said, Vs tend to get bored with a slower paced class, but it is good for socialization.


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## Canadian Expy (Feb 27, 2013)

We did two levels of obedience class with Aspen. Not because he needed to learn commands, as he picked them up very quickly at home, but because we wanted to work on teaching him to listen when there are fun distractions around - pups and people - and of course, the socialization. 

We found a trainer that conducts small training session (4 dogs max.) which meant that there was minimal time for boredom, and our instructor was always sure to end each class on a positive note for the pups. Aspen was (and still is) a bundle of energy so I would always take him for a walk/run before class to tire him out a bit which seemed to help *most* times, but even then he would always be the "character" of the class. It's part of their Vizsla charm  I truly think our trainer enjoyed his more challenging days (though I did not!). 

If you find the right trainer the experience for the pup (and owner) can be beneficial and fun, so I wouldn't write off classes altogether if they are something you want to participate in. For future classes I would seek the services of a trainer more suitable to your needs and expectations. 

Good luck with the classes and enjoy your completely normal bundle of energy ;D


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## getsome (Oct 14, 2013)

It seems to me, after having been to a whopping 2 puppy kindergarten classes so far, that you're entitled to a judgement free experience. But if I look at Dash's behavior compared to the other 10 or so puppies, he was probably more vocal and bouncy than the rest. During the free play time, he repeatedly found his little bulldog girlfriend and humped her head. you should have seen the look on her owner's face. Completely appalled. But the 5 trainers all took it in stride and thought it was just goofy puppy antics. We've been accepted with open arms at the training club. I hope you're able to find a similar group of like-minded folks that are willing to work with what you've got.
Oh, and I learned quickly that bringing a tired puppy will only help your cause. Good luck!
~B


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## lyra (Nov 2, 2012)

Bit sad that a 'trainer' can't enjoy a dog with a bit more personality than most in the class. Doesn't sound as though they are very committed to what they do.

That said, the socialisation alone is probably worth it - and that isn't just the time they spend playing but being in a small environment together. 

Also, I think you may be thinking too narrowly of the purpose of training. Lyra was our first dog (we even went to the extreme of going to two different puppy training groups on different days of the week). As you have found, they are bright dogs that learn quickly - unfortunately they can also fairly quickly realise that they can ignore you when they want. The best trainers don't train the dog, they train you! However good a trainer, their work won't last unless you can keep your dog doing what you want it to do.

Through our inexperience we had a tough time with Lyra for many months from about six months old when she decided she could just completely ignore us when it suited her. We were one of those sad people who had to hide to get our dogs to come back to us when a walk ended etc. You are going to have many happy hours with your dog but you can never start too early when it comes to installing an understanding that it has to do what you say whatever the distractions. Now I wouldn't be expecting miracles from a puppy but maybe you could use your puppy training time to explore techniques to get it just a little bit more focussed on what you want and not what it wants! It's all part of building up that bond.

For the record, we ended up having to have one to one lessons to correct our shortcomings and now at 18 months Lyra is a joy to take out (if not quite perfect!)


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## Ruthie_67 (Jan 25, 2014)

Thanks all for your honest and experienced replies I appreciate them all. Had noticed that our boy is often tired for the classes so am going to try and get sleep time in before them. I had wondered about the difference of this breed compared to others since being on here and reading about them but am beginning to realise that our Vs are one of a kind. I have to be able to create a balance for him and puppy classes is one way he will be treated and expected to act the same way as the other less vocal and energetic breeds so I will continue with the classes. Am disappointed in lack of instructors understanding but hey maybe I can educate her as well


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## redbirddog (Apr 23, 2010)

Ruthie,
Want to have fun? When they teach "sit" have your pointer "stand" on your left side at your knee. Tell the instructor (quietly before class) that you have a Hungarian Pointer, which is a noble hunting dog, and pointers don't sit, they stand.



> Had noticed that our boy is often tired for the classes so am going to try and get sleep time in before them.


Actually you want your boy tired for class and well fed about one hour before. That will mellow him out a bit. Try some poultry. It has the mild sedative trytophan in it. We use turkey meat.

_L-tryptophan is an essential amino acid. The body can't make it, so diet must supply tryptophan. Amino acids are building blocks of proteins. Foods rich in tryptophan include, you guessed it, turkey. Tryptophan is also found in other poultry, meat, cheese, yogurt, fish, and eggs.

Tryptophan is used by the body to make niacin, a B vitamin that is important for digestion, skin and nerves, and serotonin. Serotonin is a brain chemical that plays a large role in mood) and can help to create a feeling of well-being and relaxation. "When levels of serotonin are high, you're in a better mood, sleep better, and have a higher pain tolerance,"_ says Elizabeth Somer, MA, RD, author of numerous nutrition books, including her latest, Eat Your Way to Happiness.


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## Chaos911 (Oct 30, 2013)

Oh my I'm chuckling at the puppy school posts. Blaze had his first class last eve which my husband had to take Blaze due to my being unavailable. He had never taken any of our previous dogs. Prefers to be the beneficiary of classes, which has been fine . But bless his heart he went. Came home, immediately grabbed a beer (not really a drinker ) and headed to the man cave... never saw him the rest of the eve! :0. Said insane to ask them to sit thru 1+ hr lecture and keep pup on sit or lie. Guess back to me and puppy school. Ours is thru local kennel club. Anxious to see how it goes. We've had stars and a puppy school dropout. I think I'm going to try to get good walk in before next class.


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## Ozkar (Jul 4, 2011)

I'm with RBD. But I believe an experienced gun dog trainer with Vizsla experience would be the most beneficial path. Not that you have to hunt with your pup, but a good gun dog trainer with V experience will know what is needed and will understand the slightly err.....different behaviour of our Russet Gold "Nutters"  

I went to one puppy class with Ozkar and his mum and could not go back. I would have ended up on an assault charge as the trainer was not V aware and made some disparaging comments about both Ozkar and us. Plus they also had different trainers each week, so not consistent.....except in their lack of understanding of a V.  

Ozkar ended up finishing the puppy classes, but it was not really any benefit to him. It helped his mum to learn about training to some degree, but in all honesty to me it was a WOFTAM.


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## hoovers7 (Sep 5, 2013)

This has already been said but I would find a new trainer. Our first one was harsher than I would have liked so I tried a different person. Toby and I go to obedience classes all the time. Typically he learns all of the commands faster than some of the other dogs. He gets bored when the instructor is speaking so he will talk. Yes I said talk, not whine or bark. It will sound like he is actually trying to form words. Like your dog he also does better in a distraction free environment or at home. However, life is not distraction free. So, I think it is important that he go to classes and socialize. I know these things have been said already, just adding my 2 cents.


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## Ruthie_67 (Jan 25, 2014)

Yes it does seem that the socialization part is perhaps one of the most important things and I know what you mean about the talking. I have found it is always for a reason and never just for the sake of it, in fact as it turned out my boy wanted to go out to the toilet rather than poop on the floor like the other dogs do. We have only 2 classes left and after that I will try to find a specialist gun dog trainer who understands that this breed are exceptionally amazing


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## R E McCraith (Nov 24, 2011)

socialization is a great skill & part of puppy school - past that a V is a gun dog and really only needs commands that keep him safe in the field and at home - so if I were to go 2 puppy school I would give the instructor a list of commands that I will use for the pups life - may not V the same as they teach - when it comes to tricks - go 2 the circus LOL - V's are working dogs - they should V treated with RESPECT - in return they respect you !


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## hcrowder (Dec 26, 2013)

The first three weeks at out puppy class were awful. The room was tiny and filled with dogs and we had to keep them calm the whole time. Penny was a struggle to say the least. But, the trainers had worked with Vs before and they were helpful one on one. After three weeks we were moved to the 12 week and older puppy class and it is much better. There is more space and we actually get to practice at class. Penny loves it. She never pulls as hard on the lead as when ewe get close to the building the class is in. 

We are lucky in that penny does not really bark or whine. She learns some of the commands really quickly but sucks at others. For example, she will go down from a sit but not from standing. She bows but will never lower her butt. The trainers told me to wait her out and she will eventually lower her rear to the floor. When I couldn't get it to work, which I knew penny wouldn't give in, the trainer came over to help. She also couldn't get penny to perform but she didn't get embarrassed and she admitted that it isn't that big of a deal. She gave us intermediate steps to work on at home that I was able to get penny to do and she moved on to the next part of the lesson. 

We actually let penny take a nap before class rather than wear her out. She gets so stimulated by the class and having to behave that she is exhausted but the time the hour class is over. She is very well behaved at class and I think it takes all her effort to show off. ???


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## getsome (Oct 14, 2013)

This has been interesting reading. I took my tired 12wk old V to his 3rd week of puppy class last night. It was awful. He was, by no small margin, the worst behaving dog in the bunch. It was thoroughly exhausting, and I found myself pretty frustrated. Every other puppy was sitting nicely staring at their owner while Dash took it upon himself to choke himself by straining on the leash, desperately trying to get to a couple of his favorite buddies. And one time, during one of the play breaks, he just headed right for the water dish. Didn't even go sniff a butt. It was a very long hour for me. He seemed to have a pretty good time. Whew!
~B


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## hcrowder (Dec 26, 2013)

We use a no tug harness at class and it is a lifesaver. When Penny decides to be crazy (which is rare since switching to the harness) it is easy to correct her and she doesn't coke herself.


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