# crate training



## Shany (Dec 8, 2012)

Hello,

My Milo is almost 3 months old now and I recently got her a larger crate. I left her in there for about 6 hours while I was at work and coming back I found pee all over the blankets I had put in there. She's not a big fan of it, especially during the day (during the night I use a smaller crate which she seems to accept more easily). She cried madly when I left for work and came back to the same brain numbing sounds. Today I left the crate doors open to show her that it's not the prison she might think it is and tried getting her in there. I eventually came out successful and she slept on and off for a few hours. 
This morning she was alone in the crate for about 2 hours and having given her a bone to chew, she may have not realized when I left home. She wasn't crying when I got back, either.

Having said that, I am still afraid that she'll cry next time I go to work. How do I properly introduce her to the crate? How do I get her to like it more and cry less? Also... should I leave food in there or just water? 

Thank you!


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## MilesMom (Jun 21, 2012)

I think that you are doing the right thing by putting her in there for short bouts. I would put her in her crate for a couple sessions per day during training, even if you are home so she gets used to the routine. Kongs always helped our puppy, and we also found that leaving Dog TV or music helped. We also covered part of the crate. 

Keep up the shorter sessions, play with her around the crate and give her a treat when she goes in. It takes time, she wants to be with her people vs in a crate! Took us a few weeks until Miles went in easily and remained quiet during the day.


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## deanfootlong (May 21, 2012)

you on the right track with leaving the crate open and putting treats in there and for short amounts of time. shes peeing in there because theres room for her to pee. does your crate have a divider? we have ours so Sierra has just enough room to turn around and lay down. she doenst pee where she sleeps.


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## deanfootlong (May 21, 2012)

as far as getting her to cry less..... just gotta be tough and let her cry for a while. pretty soon she will figure it out. 

we dont leave any food or water in Sierras crate. fyi.


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## Shany (Dec 8, 2012)

No, the bigger crate doesn't have a divider. She was in it for about 6 hours so she peed. I was hoping she'd hold it in, but I guess at 3 months that's a little too much to ask... In the smaller crate, the one she sleeps in during the night, she doesn't go at all and today she even let me sleep in till 10 thirty! 

I only leave her with water and some toys while I'm out. What I meant by food in the crate, is should I feed her in it while I'm home with her? Will this help her like her crate a little better? I know not to leave food in there when she's home alone because then she'll want to poop. 

I give her treats, but once she's done chewing on them, she goes back to barking and yelping. I guess persistence is the only way to go. 

The biting and nipping have improved. So has peeing in the house, she goes less and less.
Could anybody tell me at around what age do they calm down a little, pee, nipping and barking wise? I heard someone say around 7 months. 

Thank you everybody!


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## lyra (Nov 2, 2012)

Some things will never go away unless you teach her they are not acceptable. Nipping is a good example; you have to teach her it is not acceptable otherwise she will never stop. Search the forums/internet - there are plenty of ideas how to do this. From eight weeks we taught Lyra to bite softly then after a few weeks we taught her she wasn't allowed to bite us at all.

Six hours is a long time to crate any Vizsla let alone a puppy. Is there nobody who could come in for half an hour to break it up?


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## Shany (Dec 8, 2012)

Well no, unfortunately. Mom comes to help with her and that's how it's just 6 hours. Before that I would leave her in the bedroom in a small open door crate. She chewed on my bed sheets so with this new big crate that I can also put a bowl of water in, I was hoping she wouldn't ruin anything anymore. She's just peeing in it now... 

I really don't know what else to do. I don't wanna leave her in the bedroom and I know she's gonna go in the crate next time I leave her... 
Suggestions anybody?


Thanks


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## lyra (Nov 2, 2012)

You will have to crate her or she will destroy everything. I'm not sure I would leave water in her crate. A puppy of that age can go through the night without a 'topup' so I'm not sure it would do her any harm to go without while she is in the crate. A vet or someone with more experience might be able to guide you in regards to this.


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## Shany (Dec 8, 2012)

During the night she has nothing in her crate and sleeps like a baby.
I've been told to leave her with water when I'm away from home, but no food. 

We're getting better at this crate thing. I put her in there about an hour ago, she yelped and barked for about 20 mins and now she's asleep. Just hope she doesn't cry too much when I go to work. I feel so sorry for my neighbors. 

Thanks Lyra


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## Kay92 (Oct 19, 2012)

Maybe I missed it somewhere in the post but where is the crate located? When Riley was a pup we had the crate upstairs and our neighbors would hear him barking. Once we moved it downstairs so he could see the front door never barked again.


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## Shany (Dec 8, 2012)

I live in an apartment building, so no upstairs for me. I set the crate in the living room and when barking, she can be heard from way down the street. 
I'm considering putting the crate in the bedroom which is at the back of the house. I'm hoping less noise for neighbors... 

The problem with the crate is that it's so wide I can't get it through my hallway, so I'll have to dismantle it and then put it back together in the bedroom. Which means the crate will be there permanently. I still haven't found a solution for the living room... where will Milo stay when she's there with me. Took away her bed. 

Is anybody also using a bed for puppies or just the crate? I kinda feel sorry for her, having her stay in the crate all the time.. At times I let her come up on the sofa next to me. Is that too bad?

Thanks!


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## Krystleajustice (Dec 22, 2012)

She is only 12 weeks so won't be able to hold her pee for 6 hours!! She will also still be missing her mum and litter mates. It's natural for puppies to cry when left alone as its what would determine their survival in the wild. Can you get a dog walker to split up the day? Vizslas are not a great breed for people who are out all day, they are called Velcro dogs for a reason! I don't mean to sound negative but I did a lot of research about the breed beforehand to make sure our lifestyle would be suitable. Vizsla are also prone to separation anxiety as they were bred to not stray too far from their masters side during hunting. Puppy crèche could also be an option.


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## city_dog (Feb 16, 2012)

we have a crate liner in Sammy's crate, but nothing too fluffy - she would just rip it apart!
Have you tried covering the crate with a light blanket?


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## Shany (Dec 8, 2012)

Krystleajustice, it's not my first Vizsla, however the previous one was 6 years old when I got her and she was an angel. I'm not comparing my 3 month old Milo with my previous 6 year old Nana. 

I don't think 6 h is too much to be away from home.. I gotta work, as do many of us who have dogs and I strongly believe she's better off with me than roaming the streets or in a hostile home. During weekends I try to be with her 24 h a day. Puppy creche.. I'd wish, but I don't think Israel is there yet.

city_dog, yes, I have covered her crate with a large bed sheet, but she just tries to pull it by the sides thru the openings in her crate. The cloth doesn't help with the crying... 

Is 3 months too young for maybe putting her in a doghouse for a week or two to get her trained? I am just afraid I might not be handling her right, tho I do love her and try my best. I just know how crucial my behavior towards her is now..


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## Shany (Dec 8, 2012)

Aww Kevin, thank you so much for taking the time to write all this. 
She is the sweetest thing when she sleeps. Right now she's all cuddled next to me on the sofa.

I know you're right about not leaving her in the crate for 6 hours.. She has a smaller crate, one she sleeps in at night and lets me sleep in in the mornings. When I would leave her in that crate, with the door open, a bowl of water and newspapers lying around for her wee wee, she destroyed my bed sheets. There would be wee wee all over the bedroom floor. So I tried to keep the damage to a minimum and maybe get her to have some little control over the bladder. I was fully aware 6 hours is a long time, but still I thought I'd try. 

I wish I had someone with her 24/7.. and if it wasn't for mom coming to help, she would've been alone for 8 h...

Milo goes out about 6-7 times a day, about 20 mins each time, as opposed to 10 times just last week. She now only wees a few times in the crate and once in the evening, if she wakes up and takes me a little longer to hit my let's go wee! button. 

I can't wait for her to be allowed to meet other dogs and take her to the park to get some of that energy out. 

Say hello to Hegy from us, he sounds like such a good boy!

Thanks again, Kevin


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## Shany (Dec 8, 2012)

I think my neighbors would personally just rather see me move to a different country... 
I will try to find someone tho. Do u think breaking the 6 hours in 2 is enough? 

I've seen Hegy's pics, he looks adorable! 
New Year's resolution, change the wallpaper. The little guy obviously doesn't like it.


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## Shany (Dec 8, 2012)

Ok. Will do. Will try to find someone to take her out, even if it's just once during the 6 h. 

How many times would you take Hegy out at 3 months? The vet told me she shouldn't be walking too much at this age, since V's are prone to hip dysplasia. So I just try to follow her needs and we play a lot with the ball outside. The rest of the time is just small walks. 

Until I find that dog sitter.. should I leave her in her crate in the living room as I do now or should I put her in the bedroom where there's less stuff to be destroyed and leave the crate door open so she can wee wee outside of it? 

6 years sounds promising...


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## Shany (Dec 8, 2012)

Thanks so much Kevin!

Your idea is great, but I'm not sure I can fit the small crate in the larger one. Will try tonight tho. As I have to leave for work and take her out for a wee wee again, I will use newspapers in her crate for now. 
And yes, you got it right, I have a large crate in the living room and a small one in the bedroom that she sleeps in at night. 

Have been playing with the ball with her this morning twice already and I see she's calmer once we come back home. 

She's still not done with her shots at the vet so she can't interact with other dogs. Once we're done with that, I have a huge park right across the building. That will definitely tire her!

For now it's just the small garden in the parking lot behind my building. 

Am definitely looking into a dog sitter for her.

Thanks again!


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## Shany (Dec 8, 2012)

Well.. I could attach the small one to the large one.. But the picture in my mind is rather weird, cause that would mean make her go from the large one into the small one and the minute she jumps from one to the other, they would come apart and my furniture is history. Or maybe I'm blonde and don't understand you... 

The newspapers in the crate didn't help. She tore those apart and peed on her pillow. 
Looking forward to finding a sitter ASAP. 


I will leave you now to welcome New Year's properly.

Thanks again for everything Kevin, now go have fun!


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## lyra (Nov 2, 2012)

Shany said:


> The vet told me she shouldn't be walking too much at this age, since V's are prone to hip dysplasia. So I just try to follow her needs and we play a lot with the ball outside. The rest of the time is just small walks.


From everything I have read (and I'm sure someone will correct me if I am wrong), Vizsla's are *not* particularly prone to hip displasia. It does happen (as it can with all dogs) but is not common. The reason there is so much emphasis on hip scoring is to try and make sure it doesn't become a problem as it has with some breeds.

Walking limits was discussed a little here: http://www.vizslaforums.com/index.php/topic,6654.0.html


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## Shany (Dec 8, 2012)

Thanks Lyra, just read your thread.
So I'm doing it all wrong apparently, since what I do with her is throw and fetch the ball. 
She's not so much into walking at 3 months old, so I don't really know what to do to get some of those energies out. She goes out about 6-7 times a day, out of which about 2-3 times we play with the ball. Each time we spend around 20-30 mins outside. 

I guess the running for the ball could cause her hip dysplasia.. So what other games would you suggest?

Come summer, she will be at the beach every weekend!


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## lyra (Nov 2, 2012)

Firstly, as far as I have found, nobody has done any proper research into how early excercise affects joints. A healthy joint needs well developed muscle around it as well as healthy bone and cartilage so exercise can actually improve joints in the right circumstances. 

Long and short of it is I don't worry too much about it. Lyra loves her walks. We are fortunate enough to live by the sea so most of her walking is done on sand. 

I'm more concerned she is well socialised which means plenty of chances to get out and meet other dogs and people and our beach is brilliant for that.


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## luv2laugh (Oct 6, 2011)

Hi Shaney,

I highly highly highly recommend "after you get your puppy" by Ian Dunbar. It has a really helpful setup for crate training. It's available as a free pdf online, so even if you don't want to follow it to a tee, it's a helpful read.

http://www.dogstardaily.com/files/downloads/AFTER_You_Get_Your_Puppy.pdf

As for breaking up the six hours into 2 sets of 3 hours. That's a great idea. We ended up hiring a dog walker for the boy when he was that age. There are a lot of people who do this. They do anywhere from 15 minute potty sessions (just taken out for potty) to an hour play session or walk.

I have heard that Vs are prone to hip displaysia due to their build. My understanding is that as long as they are off leash they are fine. Off leash, they stop and sprint and make lots of different movements, so it is not too hard on them. It is walking or running on a leash/bike which you need to pace as it is the same repetitive motion over and over and over again. I'm going to attach a flyer on exercise that a breeder gave me when I was asking about Vs. It's called "Puppies and Exercise - Not so Much" and gives a guideline for proper amounts.


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## Racer (Apr 23, 2012)

I wouldn't worry too much about the neighbors right now. Think of it this way. If you had a baby, it would cry and potentially "annoy" neighbors. It's a part of life. Provided you can get your pup settled with her crate, it's just a passing thing. If needed, talk to your adjacent neighbors and explain the situation. People in general are pretty understanding, esp. if you at least talk to them.

Of course, they won't be happy if Milo never accepts the crate. My boy was not happy about the crate when left alone. The usual thing everyone says is make the crate a positive experience. For this I did a few things that IMHO were helpful. I fed all meals in the crate. You need to build up to having them eat with the door locked as well as you leaving them in the crate even after they're done. This will take time. Gradually closing the door and most likely having to re-open it right away. Over time, you'll eventually be able to lock the crate door without them noticing. One key thing initially is to make sure, when they are almost done, to make sure you open the door. 

I also played a lot of games around the crate. I did nosework with him as pup, making him find treats. He typically started in the crate. Some times, I would make him start elsewhere in the apartment, but would then hide the treats in the crate. And at the end of the day, he always got treats for going in the the crate for bed.

Some other things that help are to continuously go in and out of your place for no reason when they are in the crate. This is so no anxiety builds for hearing the signs that you're leaving. And don't let her out as soon as you get back. The general rule is make the crate a good thing as well as don't give off bad/nervous vibes when you have to put them in the crate (they pick up on that).

At this point, my boy is 14 months and he loves his crate. At the end of the day, he wants in desperately. But will only go there if we're going to bed. After the last potty break of the day, he goes straight there hoping it will be lights out. He's also in the crate for anytime there isn't anyone around for more than 15 min. 

Just remember like people, every dog is different. So you'll have to adjust accordingly. For example, he never liked kongs at all. So we actually never leave anything in the crate with him. Sounds weird, but he really just sleeps. Part of that is also probably because he gets a really hard run for at least 1hr. first thing in the morn.

Oh, one last thing. About your crate. Perhaps you can just buy a new one that has a divider? Then just sell the old one. Or maybe build a make shift barrier? One thing I did find a bit "worrisome" was you mentioning about not wanting to move the crate because you'd have do dismantle it. Yet, you indicated after moving it, it would become "permanent". If you dismantled it once, you should be able to move it again. Yeah, I get it is probably a pain in the A, but initially every pup requires a lot of work. Sorry if that sounds too negative. I moved the boy crates a few times when he was really young. It was a royal pain, but some times you gots to do what you gots to do. Everything pays off once they are older.

Good luck!


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## Shany (Dec 8, 2012)

Thanks so much everybody! I really don't know what I'd do without this forum.

Racer, Milo has 2 crates. The large one located in the living room that she's in for about 6 hours a day, and a smaller one she took to pretty fast in the bedroom that she sleeps in at night. I thought I'd dismantle the big one (large enough for a full grown dog) and put in the bedroom so as to minimize the noise that my neighbors' ears have to deal with. I have to admit I am pretty luckily neighbors wise, they seem very understanding so far. In the living room I guess she'd be on the couch when I'm around.. This is still a dilemma for me.

Regarding Kongs, have just bought one for her yesterday, so today when I go to work will be my first attempt with it. Hopefully it will keep her busy. 

In the morning we play with the ball and she just loves it. I was worried about the joints, but I've read here that most owners weren't concerned. She does need to get some energies out. 

Regarding getting a new crate with a built in divider... I can do that, yes, but I thought I'd give the diapers a try. Bought those yesterday as well so we'll see how they work for her. I have a feeling she will tear them apart. 

In a couple of weeks she will be past her shots so she'll be able to socialize more with the other dogs in the park. 

luv2laugh, thanks for the link. Will check it tonight and put it to good use. 

Lyra, you are indeed lucky regarding the beach. I don't live far from it, but it could still add up to 30 mins driving. I don't have that time during the week since I work. Besides, it is too cold now I think. 
During the summer, she'll be a regular there. 

Thank you again so so so much! Will log back in tonight to read your posts. They are just lovely and so helpful. Thanks for caring!


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