# My almost 10 week old baby boy, super cute, very lovable but crazy play biting at times ...Am I crating him too much?



## rchik43 (Apr 12, 2020)

I know this topic has been kind of beaten to death...also think quite a few people arrived on this forum for this same reason.

I have gone through many many posts since I brought him home around 8 weeks ...regarding the biting ..I am so thankful to the responses posted here. They really helped. Also been going through many other general puppy sites to understand how to manage the biting. 

Over the last couple of weeks I have been able to manage this a little better...I noticed that he is generally ok and relatively calm in the mornings, and gets really crazy in the evenings. Also noticed that after about 10 mins of play outside the crate...he starts getting a bit cranky...so before he gets out of control I lure him back to the crate and let him rest again...Taught him to 'leave it' when he starts excessively tugging at my jeans or bites my legs...and usually he leaves it for a treat...occasionally he gets into this relatively harder biting thing and a few times I had no option but to say NO, NO and squirt some water which seemed to work and was the only time I felt like he understood what NO meant...I really didn't want to do that but after struggling for a week that is the only thing that worked...especially when he is play biting my 10 year old daughter... I do some level of bite inhibition when he is calm ...which is only a few minutes in the morning...

He gets about 20-30 minutes total of free play/walk everyday + some basic training (come, sit , stay)...Also started puppy socialization/training ...once per week

Also , I read somewhere that getting pups tired with walks/play etc would help them to not get over- excited and out of control...but I feel that with my boy...he acts more crazy when he is tired...not sure, but that's what I feel.

I have had dogs before but they were a bit easier, also older when I had them ..

Overall...what I'm going through right now, is that he is in and out of the crate all day....he cannot stay out longer than 15 minutes at a time before things start to escalate and he has no off switch LOL...What has worked for me is to play with him but get him back in the crate before he goes kinda crazy on me. Getting him back into the crate is the only way he seems to calm down. I got a bigger pen, but he hates it...seems happier with the crate.

I guess I'm going to be in this for a few months...my question is...am I crating him too much?


----------



## texasred (Jan 29, 2012)

How long total is he out of the crate in a day?
Puppies do get tired, and need rest.
But they also need lots of interaction with people. I think you need to try and distinguish, what is rough play, and what is a overtired sharky puppy.


----------



## rchik43 (Apr 12, 2020)

texasred said:


> How long total is he out of the crate in a day?
> Puppies do get tired, and need rest.
> But they also need lots of interaction with people. I think you need to try and distinguish, what is rough play, and what is a overtired sharky puppy.


Thanks for the response texasred.
Yes,I have now learnt to recognize the difference between the rough play and the overtired behavior...in the evenings he definitely looks overtired and is in a tantrum not listening to anything...in the mornings - early afternoon there is some rough play...but he still somewhat listens to a NO (sometimes) or I'm able to distract him with a sit and a treat. 

Time in crate:
He sleeps in his crate from about 9:30 Pm to 6:30 AM...very peacefully. Gets about an hour out with us including breakfast with some basic training...and a short 5-10 minute walk and some play...he starts to get overexcited then I put him back in the crate for about 1 to 1.5 hours...then take him out for a potty break and basically a 15-20 minutes out of the crate ...when he mostly plays...and then he goes back in. This cycle continues through the day..If I let him be out more than 15 to 20 minutes...I have noticed he starts to get too overexcited...beyond the rough play...so basically he is in and out of the crate through the day...the only way he calms down is by me putting him in the crate and putting a blanket to cover all sides of the crate. He does get play time with us every 1.5 hours or so and in the evening with some neighbors...he is always super good with visitors and neighbors (plays without biting/nipping)..

Also when he bites my feet...which he does often , I say 'LEAVE IT' and as soon as he leaves, reward him with a treat...he does leave, but I'm wondering if I'm doing this right or whether I'm conditioning him to bite my feet and then getting a treat? 

Thanks for your inputs!


----------



## texasred (Jan 29, 2012)

Morning, and evening times out of the crate sounds good. 
Little by little increase his times being out of the crate during the day. 
Keep on working on his bite inhibition, and it will get better. It just takes time, for them to not treat us like a littermate. It's normal for a Vizsla puppy playing, to want to turn it into a bitey game. Some are worse than others, and we just need to turn it into a training experience for them.
Crates are great for teaching puppies how to settle. The rest is up to us.


----------



## PinDave (Jul 1, 2020)

I know exactly what you mean about the increased energy release when they are tired! I did a 7.5 km walk with Maui last evening, and brought him in to the yard afterwards, and he just went crazy with furious energy! Running at top speed and jumping as high as possible at me. It’s playful - not aggressive, but intense! You’d think they’d be tired out, but it’s like they get more energy! Someone on another thread suggested that if you hold them to calm them down after exercise, that this can help, and I think I see what they mean...

Maui’s 16-weeks-old now, and has mellowed a bit. He’s only in his crate overnight or if we have to go out. He has a dog bed in our family room (he only has access to our kitchen and family room) that he is happy to go lie down on. Still have to get after him when he tries to tear it up, but we’re on him instantly about that, so it’s getting better.

I‘m no expert by any means, but I don’t think the biting games have anything to do with crate time as much as they have to do with being bored. We’ve definitely found that walking him for about 45 minutes in the morning and an hour in the evening helps immensely with bleeding off some of that energy. Playing with a tug toy or getting him to chase kibbles at lunchtime helps ease boredom. I’m finding that the unwanted behaviours are definitely attributable to boredom and a need to get energy out with exercise.


----------



## InTheNet (Jun 1, 2016)

your life should start to get better at 6 months old.


----------



## InTheNet (Jun 1, 2016)

My previous answer was not very helpful. ( it is true/but not helpful)
What you are experiencing is pretty normal. We found with ours that when they got tired is when they went into full shark attack mode. 
Try to hold and calm the pup, which is not easy. crate / or enclosure to let him unwind.

We have 6 weeks to go before our new pup is ready. Then we have 6 months of "****"


----------



## rchik43 (Apr 12, 2020)

Thanks so much Texasred, Inthenet, Pindave...really really appreciate your inputs. this forum has been super helpful already! Good to know its normal at this age. Yes the crate definitely helps...I tried holding him to calm him down, sometimes I can...sometimes he struggles too much ...will keep trying. I took him to puppy socialization where he runs around and free plays with puppies from 9-10 weeks to about 6 months old...but then he gets so very excited that we can't calm him down for the rest of the class!


----------



## Huggytree (Apr 21, 2020)

At the start I did 1 hour out of the cage then 2 hours in. Ours was a nipper too. Especially bad with my youngest daughter. He almost attacked her it was so bad. Then 1 day he just stopped. We would hold his mouth closed and say no. He liked to bite at our hands. My trainer said to shove fingers down his throat. The thinking is if he wants your hands so bad give them to him. Ha. Another idea is to fold a lip over his teeth and squeeze a bit. Basically create some pain in response to the biting.

the squirt bottle will work until the dog likes water. Our dog opens his mouth now and tries to drink the water when we squirt him.
Look forward to jumping as your dog gets older and the teething stops. Our 8 month old can jump 6’6” to lick people in the face


----------



## gunnr (Aug 14, 2009)

"the squirt bottle will work until the dog likes water."

Oh yeah. Definitely! Same with the garden hose.
I can still chase Finn around with the "Cat Bottle", and I know he has zero fear of water. It won't be long though before the squirt bottle is ineffective.
I think it's the sound it makes, more so than the water right now.


----------



## Abbeytx (Feb 7, 2017)

I learned to put Penny in her crate when she entered shark mode. Reminds me of when a toddler starts throwing a tantrum— usually means it’s time for a little nap! It was tough, the kids hated that phase, it could get a little scary at times. Even after all the reading I still wondered is THIS normal? But it passes like all the other phases!


----------



## rchik43 (Apr 12, 2020)

Thanks Huggytree, Gunnr & Abbeytx...I have not used the squirt bottle much ...First and 2nd day I used it around 3 times to distract or stop him..but may be 1 time for a couple of days after that...now usually when we use a stern NO he does seem like he is checking his impulse...I think he thinks the water is going to follow...yes, the intensity of rough play biting has taken some getting used too...I am kind of used to dogs and this is not the first dog for me...but the intensity is definitely a couple of notches higher! Yeah...understanding when he is just about hitting the sharky mode and luring him back into the crate has worked best for me so far. 

Abbeytx...just curious...how long did this phase last for Penny? I know a few people have said around 6 months...


----------



## Huggytree (Apr 21, 2020)

Mine stopped nipping at 4.5-5 months

take your dog outside to play fetch when he starts nipping. I’d rather wear him out vs caging him

Your dog will improve. Just give it time


----------



## orangeversion (Jul 6, 2020)

rchik43 said:


> I know this topic has been kind of beaten to death...also think quite a few people arrived on this forum for this same reason.
> 
> I have gone through many many posts since I brought him home around 8 weeks ...regarding the biting ..I am so thankful to the responses posted here. They really helped. Also been going through many other general puppy sites to understand how to manage the biting.
> 
> ...


Your puppy is really small that's why he is doing this. And I think you are doing right everything. Don't lose hope. Until your dog becomes a proper adult he will keep doing this. You can keep some chewable toys in the crate and see what happens and let us know.


----------



## rchik43 (Apr 12, 2020)

Thx Huggytree, Orangeversion.


----------



## QueenTilly (Jul 7, 2020)

Abbeytx said:


> I learned to put Penny in her crate when she entered shark mode. Reminds me of when a toddler starts throwing a tantrum— usually means it’s time for a little nap! It was tough, the kids hated that phase, it could get a little scary at times. Even after all the reading I still wondered is THIS normal? But it passes like all the other phases!


Hi there,
I posted in a different forum asking about my vizsla pups ‘sharkies’ but I wanted to ask you about your experience and if it’s similar to mine. Our puppy Tilly is now 12 weeks old and she is so lovely! But when she is (we guess) overstimulated she starts growling and going for our hands and feet! She nips and rugs at them and it is indeed a bit scary and painful. This happens usually at the end of a walk or after something exciting/new has happened. Is this something you experienced as well? Usually we also put her in her crate and either she lets out the energy in there by protesting for around 10 mins and then sleeps or falls asleep almost straight away. Would love to hear your experience! I’m not sure her ‘aggressive’ growling in these phases is normal?
Kind regards,
Carlotta


----------



## rchik43 (Apr 12, 2020)

Hi QueenTilly,

My 11 week old pup does the exact same thing. I think from what I have gathered so far all this is normal. I am also doing the same thing at the end of the walk getting him into the crate with a small treat.. and he rests. End of the walk overstimulated...growling...he starts running ahead and then back at me and tugs at my jeans......but lately ..he tugs once and with a stern NO...he usually lets go...but is still running and in a few seconds charges back and does the same thing. I'm no expert...far from it...but this running forward and coming back to you seems like a very Vizsla thing to me...i have seen this behavior in a lot of videos...where even adult dogs run ahead and then run back to you off leash...

Overall..i think all normal puppy behavior. I'm working through the same thing.


----------



## QueenTilly (Jul 7, 2020)

rchik43 said:


> Hi QueenTilly,
> 
> My 11 week old pup does the exact same thing. I think from what I have gathered so far all this is normal. I am also doing the same thing at the end of the walk getting him into the crate with a small treat.. and he rests. End of the walk overstimulated...growling...he starts running ahead and then back at me and tugs at my jeans......but lately ..he tugs once and with a stern NO...he usually lets go...but is still running and in a few seconds charges back and does the same thing. I'm no expert...far from it...but this running forward and coming back to you seems like a very Vizsla thing to me...i have seen this behavior in a lot of videos...where even adult dogs run ahead and then run back to you off leash...
> 
> Overall..i think all normal puppy behavior. I'm working through the same thing.


Thank you for your reply!! I always feel better when someone else is experiencing the same thing haha 😊


----------



## Frida010 (Apr 24, 2020)

Same here: Fred is 13,5 weeks old and when her bites hurt she is too tired and needs to be put in her crate to sleep.


----------

